friendship sloop

[Jim Budde]

Followed y'all's advice and found several sources for friendship sloop designs. By the way, the Smithsonian catalogue is great fun to look at ... thanks for suggestion. Now, here's question #2. I want a traditional plank on frame design, so think I am leaning towards copy of the Pemaquid vs Weekender series.`Only problem is the smallest (LOA) I seem to find is our host's 25' design by Hanna. So, to the question. Is it possible (and practical) to reduce drawings so as to end up w/ a 20 footer? As background, I am experienced with basic plans, tools and wood but by no means would I claim to be very competent at drafting / redesign.

[Keith Wilson]

If you mean just building an 80% scale model of the original without other changes, in a word, no. To oversimplify somewhat, stability of a given hull shape is proportional to the cube of the size, so a reduction to 0.8 would be about half as stable. That's why smaller boats are usually proportionately wider. You can stretch out the length without much problem, or perhaps enlarge the whole thing a bit , but reductions don't generally work well. It would be quite a different boat, and would really require redesigning.

As I recall, the Muscongas Bay sloops looked like Friendship Sloops with a centerboard, and were generally smaller; see Chapelle's "American Small Sailing Craft" aka The Bible.

[This message has been edited by Keith Wilson (edited 07-24-2001).]

[Jim Budde]

Thanks, Keith .... seemd too simple. I'll keep looking for size appropriate plans and will also look at your suggestion, the Muscongas Bay sloop

[This message has been edited by Jim Budde (edited 07-24-2001).]

[Bob Cleek]

A few tips if you are really serious. Yes, the Smithsonian (American Merchant Marine Survey) catalog is full of interesting stuff, but the problem is most all of the plans are only partial... hulls and no sail plan, elevations and no lines, and so on. Few if any have the offset tables, so you are really starting with the bare bones plans-wise. Moreover, a lot of them have errors. The AMMS was a WPA project that employed a lot of draftsmen during the Depression (the 1930's, not the one we are about to have...) and some weren't too careful or too knowledgable about naval drafting. You get some strange lines in there when you look close.

For God's sake, don't limit yourself to WB's plans catalog. Good stuff in there, but very limited. Check the mentioned Chapelle volumes for a start. Look at Atkin's stuff and so on. (Be careful of Culler... pretty, but soft on technical ability.)

Most importantly, opt for a Friendship design that has been either 1) tried and true by somebody else first as a GOOD design or 2) designed by a very well respected NA and proven to be a good design. Friendships, like all workboats, were evolutions. A lot of them weren't necessarily stable or as good sailers as they could have been. A lot of old boat plans exist only because somebody took the lines off an OLD, and not necessarily a GOOD, boat. This is especially true with the NMMS collection.

[jerry s]

Jim, Phil Bolger has a nice design for a 20' friendship. You might want to get in touch with his organization.

[Dave K]

I don't know if anyone is reading these older pages (except me, making up for lost time) - but one of the prettiest Friendship Sloop designs is a 22 footer done by McKie Roth; I believe the plans are available from the bath Maritime Museum in Bath, Maine (sorry, I do not know th eproper address). If they don't have them, theym ay know where to get them - awfully pretty little vessel.

[David Toner]

Punch up http://www.by-the-sea.com/bakerboatworks/ and take a look at his Two-Forty design. While not a true friendship sloop, it fits your criteria pretty well. Although it shows an open design, it would not be difficult to design a small "Friendship" style cabin on her to further look the part.
There is a photo of her in the boats for sale section of WoodenBoat #174 Page138. She is the first boat listed. She's a beauty.
David