A boat for a trip around the globe...please HELP!

[Karol]

Hello everyone who will read this!

I need advice that will change the next 4 years of my life. I want to build a boat, which I would like to sail around the globe (with couple of friends). I am not a sailor and my boat-building experience is limited to a small “weekender” which I am building right now; however woodworking is my passion and I am always willing to learn and experiment.
The only restrictions on the boat would be that:
1. Wooden (gaff rig would be nice)
2. Up to 35 – 38 ft in length, smaller is better for me.
3. Capable of sailing around the globe and surviving my handling of it
4. Up to 5 people on-board, for extended periods of time (all non-sailors as of right now)

This would not be a race but rather a leisurely trip.

Does building a boat like this, require specific skills beyond your average, patient woodworker? I would have approx. 12 to 16 months to build it. Building would take place in a heated shed, the hull would most likely be cold-molded. I would use good quality materials, but nothing fancy. How much would a boat like this cost (Reasonable)? Is it enough time to construct a good quality, ocean going vessel? Is there anything else I should consider? Should I get it custom designed or perhaps buy and already existing design? Any advice will be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

Karol

[paladin]

Strip planked, cold molded over in the 38-39 foot class heavy construction cutter...about 12-14K in epoxy materials, 9000 in wood if you don't go really fancy...wood mast, staylocks on wire, one set of sails......if you have two or three really Reliable friends that can work full time on the boat....we're talking9-10 hour days, 6 days a week...you might get a boat built for about 50-60K cash outlay, not counting tools, somewhere to work, living expenses, etc...built in 14-16 months. Five people on a boat that size is not an adventure...it's a ghetto...and how much cash are you going to have to foot the bills after building the boat...we're talking bare bones here..pencil and paper, plastic sextant, used charts hand water pumps...sun shower...but it can be done....... http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/biggrin.gif

[AngWood]

Before you do anything else, read Buehler's Backyard Boatbuilding by George Buehler. It is a great book, written for people just like you. He believes boats should be sturdy and cheap and seaworthy, and most if not all of his designs are oceangoing. I think he has several in your size range.

[ishmael]

Buehler has a web site, tho I don't have the address.

[abe]

No advice, but read an interesting account of the building and current round the globe voyage of the Iwalani:


http://worldvoyagers.com/

[Ian McColgin]

Perhaps you have the guts I have not, to build a boat from scratch, but for a different take and considering that building a good boat can take some years:

Consider getting experience on a variety of boats of the general type you're interested in and really learn some seamanship. The buy a boat sound enough that you can get her shipshape and seaworthy. Less time, less cost, and more learning.

I think that your crew size and boat size might be a bit snug, given that some streaches need provisioning for well over 90 days. If you're among the blessed, perhaps you can find a servicable Colin Archer or cut your crew to one other and go with a Vertue.

People have set out with astounding ignorance and won through. Was it "Imporbably Voyage" about the Aussie WWII vet stranded in South America at demob who bought some old boat, learned the basics in a week, and set out to find his bride. Made it, too.

But novices can make some interesting mistakes. I remember from the late '60's a dreamer who built a ketch. The workmanship was stunning - he was a cabinet maker and was very smart about structural integrity. He rather extensivly modified the design as he went along but since he didn't know much about boats, he managed to build a crank. When I met him he'd fought the rudder from New London to Port Jefferson, self and family exhausted. I couldn't solve her problems and enlisted Drake Sparkman to look her over. He couldn't solve them either.

On the happiest note, the Carrs do not appear to have known alot about boats before they hooked up with Cerlew, to whom they have been happily married for, is it three decades now?

If you really must build from new, Check Herraschoff's "Sensible Cruising Designs" for Didakka (spelling approxomate at best) or Neria or one of those nice little ketches.

In that size and for your use, I recommend no engin. You'll have seriously more room for stores. Don Street aside, you often need some power to get into an atol as the gap is often on the lee side, but a dink with an outboard will do the job.

G'luck

[paladin]

My second circumnavigation was made in a Bruce Roberts Offshore 38 homebuilt, no engine but there wasn't room for 5. Mild steel rigging, virtually no electronics or refrigeration.

[ken mcclure]

The Beuhler website is:

http://www.georgebuehler.com/Welcome.html

And what Ian said. Look for a good used one, spend the time with repair/refit.

Here's an example of a used one (may be too small, but you can get an idea).

http://yachtworld.com/listing/yw_listing_detail.jsp?checked_boats=783294&currency=USD&units=Feet

Good luck!

[TomRobb]

Sounds like stary-eyed dreaming to me.
The lawyers for his surviving heirs will probably want to know who advised him in this http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/frown.gif (Y'all might want to adjust your insurance coverage to suit)
Five people in a 35/38 foot boat for months/years? Murder? Canabalism? The National Inquirer will love it http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/biggrin.gif

[This message has been edited by TomRobb (edited 08-01-2001).]

[Ed Harrow]

Leaving ALL the boat needs aside for a moment, grab your friends, hop in a cool shower for ten minutes, crawl, together, in your still wet clothes, into what passes for a 4 person tent these days for the night, get up tomorrow, hop in the shower again, stand/sit within a marked of area of approx 30 x 10 feet all day, take a cool shower, all pile back into the tent for the night. Do that for a WEEK. If you're all still talking then you might consider investigating the idea further.

[BrianCunningham]

Take it from someone who still has his boat in the living room, BUILD A DINGY FIRST!!!

SWIFTWOOD is a prototype for a much larger craft, is was suppose to be done in 6month HA!

Find a small craft of similar design/construction, and build it first. You'll be suprized what you learn. http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/wink.gif

[paladin]

Gawd! If I had listened to youse guys I would never have gone sailing....but then 40 years ago I just decided I wanted to do it one way or the other......
Karol..listen to EVERYONE! and then make your own decision.
BUT FIVE PEOPLE! Listen a bit to Ed Harrow....but change the rules slightly. All water for showers is in plastic jugs...each person gets 5 gals per day...pack all the food in boxes, no refrigeration...and do this for a week. ALL your cooking, bathing, drinks etc come from your water supply. No cheating....and at the end of the week see if you are all still good friends...

[Wild Dingo]

Karol

Follow the advice given and you should be right... Learn the ropes first mate! Get out on a boat for awhile, then do as ED says!! http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/biggrin.gif

Your time frame to build sounds a bit short to me, and the numbers too many for an extended ocean passage on such a small boat.

Having said that you have recieved some very sound advice mate listen to what these fellas say! Its a damn site better than I got when I first mentioned my own intentions here! Why is Bob soooo quiet on this one?? what no "fuggedaboudit"?? http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/biggrin.gif

If you have the dream, desire, time and interest enough to learn you can do it. You have to be able to listen, read, think clearly, logically, rationally and sanely mmmmm did I forget anything? But if you can do all that then go for it.

Oh another thing I saw someone say on another thread was "forget the time schedule" you will miss it or you will rush something important (like safety) just to make it! Not a truer word was said!

Also remember theres a whole lot more to building a boat than whacking a few bits of wood together, throwing a bit of sail up, hittin it over the head with a bottle of the good stuff and simply sailing over the horizon! And from what youve said mate you know very little about what your planning.

So plan on spending a fair bit of time to learn! http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/biggrin.gif

Take it easy
Shane

[Andrew]

With five people, first time builders, I'd consider one of Wharram's big catamarrans.

http://www.wharram.com/Pahi_image13.shtml

Do some sailing first. Take a live aboard one or two week course with some of your friends. Then bare boat charter for a few weeks. Not to discourage you, the dream and reality are ofter very different.

[Karol]

Hello again!

Thank you for all the replies I've received. After what I read I think I might buy a used wooden boat. I would not want to risk the boat breaking apart in the middle of the Pacific! I guess I will have to disappoint my friends.. But then I might do it (circumnavigate) more than once :), so they all will get a chance to go on it. I will finish the boat I'm building now, and learn how to sail first, only then will I begin to think about buying a bigger boat. Thank you all again! Also if anyone wants to add anything, please do. THanks again.

Karol

[Dale Harvey]

The old Jim Brown Searunner 37 will do you right. Can't hardly go wrong with this easily built time proven design. You can buy an old one needing work, but by the time you get done it would be easier to build from scratch. They still sell pretty well, so you stand to to make something on your labor. They outsail Wharrams 2to1 and monohulls 3to1, they float even when severly damaged, and if you go aground its only waist deep. All sorts of totally ignorant people have taken off on them and survived.

[paladin]

If you want to go just yourself or one friend a Searunner 31 or 34 is the boat to build. I built my 31 and in the water in 6 months and it circumnavigated......

[Wild Dingo]

Andrew, the Pahi 63 you linked to would be way too big and way to expensive for what I think Karol is after. Also they are catamarans and he hasnt yet mentioned if he is inclined that direction or not...

Mind you... I am at present seriously considering building the Wharram Tiki 38 design which will be a lot more economical and practical than the Wharram "flagship" with more than enough room for 5 - 6 and far more user friendly.

There is also the craft of Roger Simpson that are built along the same lines as Wharram but offer the choice of either open deck ala wharram or bridgedeck styles, they also offer the strip plank building method.

Rogers prices are far more economical that JWs in that they are approx half the price (ie: Wharram Tiki38ft = $2870 for plans Simpson 12.2mtr = $1400, does JWDs higher price = better design plans? not necessarily) Simpsons also retain their value far better which may or may not be a future factor, so as another choice Karol have a look at Wharrams designs but more appropriate would be the Tiki range but also have a look at Roger Simpsons...

http://members.ozemail.com.au/~simdes/welcome.html

I guess you could get swamped with different designs and designers as I did in the early days of looking, but I think for a first build and a first major sail I agree with Andrew a Wharram would be a good option.

Take it easy
Shane

[James Manning]

I built and sailed a Weekender in the '80's and I guess I can understand how these fantasies develop. My offshore experience has been very limited... limited in fact to a charter in the relatively benign inner Hebrides off Scotland and another charter off the coast of Turkey. I went along with groups a bit smaller than you envision. Even with this very limited experience, I can say you better know the folks well because before the trips over, you are going to be deep in their vomit and s**t at least once. http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/smile.gif
I have a friend who made a great deal of money early in his life and bought outright a 38 footer, very well set up for long passages. Before buying, he gained a great deal of experience too on several voyages including a San Francisco to Hawaii run. On the maiden voyage to the Bahamas on his new boat he knocked his head really badly during a knockdown. It was a serious concussion and years later, he still has occasional seizures.
A dream certainly has power, and has been pointed out here, others have done it. Before committing those types of resources and time that will stretch into years, perhaps try a long passage as a crew member on a small boat, say a transatlantic run, before attempting this idea. Just to see if you like it.

[BrianCunningham]

Hey now I wasn't saying to skip it, just practice first on a smaller craft.

BTW go on a few charters if you can.

I will give you some insite into what interiors you like.

Wharrms will get the job done, and they're quite doable by amatures.

Center cockpits make great liveaboards.

[Ged]

I wonder whatever happened to this fellow?