CPES: good link

[Scott Rosen]

I just re-visited the rotdoctor site for the first time in over a year. The site is much improved and has some interesting and useful product testing results. They compare CPES with a number of the other so-called penetrating epoxy products. It's worth a look if you have a couple of minutes. Penetrating Epoxy Test (http://www.rotdoctor.com/test/test.html#1)

[Scott Rosen]

I just re-visited the rotdoctor site for the first time in over a year. The site is much improved and has some interesting and useful product testing results. They compare CPES with a number of the other so-called penetrating epoxy products. It's worth a look if you have a couple of minutes. Penetrating Epoxy Test (http://www.rotdoctor.com/test/test.html#1)

[Scott Rosen]

I just re-visited the rotdoctor site for the first time in over a year. The site is much improved and has some interesting and useful product testing results. They compare CPES with a number of the other so-called penetrating epoxy products. It's worth a look if you have a couple of minutes. Penetrating Epoxy Test (http://www.rotdoctor.com/test/test.html#1)

[Mr. Know It All]

Thank you Scott,I haven't checked that site in awhile either. Did you see the pic's of the one-of-a-kind 1951 Nordic outboard for sale in the classified?

http://www.rotdoctor.com/img/zine/class/011016-2.jpg

I love the lines on this one :cool:

Kevin in Ohio

[ 01-02-2003, 12:33 AM: Message edited by: Mr. Know It All ]

[Mr. Know It All]

Thank you Scott,I haven't checked that site in awhile either. Did you see the pic's of the one-of-a-kind 1951 Nordic outboard for sale in the classified?

http://www.rotdoctor.com/img/zine/class/011016-2.jpg

I love the lines on this one :cool:

Kevin in Ohio

[ 01-02-2003, 12:33 AM: Message edited by: Mr. Know It All ]

[Mr. Know It All]

Thank you Scott,I haven't checked that site in awhile either. Did you see the pic's of the one-of-a-kind 1951 Nordic outboard for sale in the classified?

http://www.rotdoctor.com/img/zine/class/011016-2.jpg

I love the lines on this one :cool:

Kevin in Ohio

[ 01-02-2003, 12:33 AM: Message edited by: Mr. Know It All ]

[John Blazy]

Great info on the site, Scott. May just have to get some. Dramatic test results. Anyone swear by it? It appears that anything that penetrates that much will do wonders to add to the longevity of wood even if the topcoat is chipped or worn off, or if an area is submerged all the time. CPES must use low molecular weight monomers to get that low of a viscosity, so the water resistance may not be as great as other epoxies, but with a higher volume of it soaked into the wood core must more than make up for that. - JB

[John Blazy]

Great info on the site, Scott. May just have to get some. Dramatic test results. Anyone swear by it? It appears that anything that penetrates that much will do wonders to add to the longevity of wood even if the topcoat is chipped or worn off, or if an area is submerged all the time. CPES must use low molecular weight monomers to get that low of a viscosity, so the water resistance may not be as great as other epoxies, but with a higher volume of it soaked into the wood core must more than make up for that. - JB

[John Blazy]

Great info on the site, Scott. May just have to get some. Dramatic test results. Anyone swear by it? It appears that anything that penetrates that much will do wonders to add to the longevity of wood even if the topcoat is chipped or worn off, or if an area is submerged all the time. CPES must use low molecular weight monomers to get that low of a viscosity, so the water resistance may not be as great as other epoxies, but with a higher volume of it soaked into the wood core must more than make up for that. - JB

[NormMessinger]

Is CPES still >70% solvents? So did RD just prove solvents flow through wood cavities better than epoxy? Did the epoxy in CPES follow the dye and solvents or stay behind? And, who builds boats out of balsa wood anyway?

[NormMessinger]

Is CPES still >70% solvents? So did RD just prove solvents flow through wood cavities better than epoxy? Did the epoxy in CPES follow the dye and solvents or stay behind? And, who builds boats out of balsa wood anyway?

[NormMessinger]

Is CPES still >70% solvents? So did RD just prove solvents flow through wood cavities better than epoxy? Did the epoxy in CPES follow the dye and solvents or stay behind? And, who builds boats out of balsa wood anyway?

[Donn]

Balsa boat that sailed to Australia:

http://www.sealord6.com/This_Balsa_boat_sailed_to_Australia.jpg

[Donn]

Balsa boat that sailed to Australia:

http://www.sealord6.com/This_Balsa_boat_sailed_to_Australia.jpg

[Donn]

Balsa boat that sailed to Australia:

http://www.sealord6.com/This_Balsa_boat_sailed_to_Australia.jpg

[Paul Denison]

Just ordered two quarts with the syringe kit. Nope, not for use on a boat but on my porch enclosure project where I have some rot at the base of some exposed columns. I'm not looking for structural help, but for stopping the rot and sealing the wood.

I'll let you know how it works.

[Paul Denison]

Just ordered two quarts with the syringe kit. Nope, not for use on a boat but on my porch enclosure project where I have some rot at the base of some exposed columns. I'm not looking for structural help, but for stopping the rot and sealing the wood.

I'll let you know how it works.

[Paul Denison]

Just ordered two quarts with the syringe kit. Nope, not for use on a boat but on my porch enclosure project where I have some rot at the base of some exposed columns. I'm not looking for structural help, but for stopping the rot and sealing the wood.

I'll let you know how it works.

[Peter Malcolm Jardine]

lots of early double wall f/g boats were cored with balsa... I ain't saying it was right :D

[Peter Malcolm Jardine]

lots of early double wall f/g boats were cored with balsa... I ain't saying it was right :D

[Peter Malcolm Jardine]

lots of early double wall f/g boats were cored with balsa... I ain't saying it was right :D

[Dave Hadfield]

Amazing. I didn't know they treated balsa log boats with CPES!

[Dave Hadfield]

Amazing. I didn't know they treated balsa log boats with CPES!

[Dave Hadfield]

Amazing. I didn't know they treated balsa log boats with CPES!

[Mr. Know It All]

It appears in the restoration of older plywood boats at least, CPES has proven to be a pretty good product, used properly for the right reasons. Although it seems expensive, it appears to be an importaint step in gaining good results with keeping at least some of the boat "original" wood and helps preserve any new wood you add to the boat. That is what I am hearing and seeing from other wooden boat friends. What do you hear and see?
Peace---> Kevin in Ohio

[Mr. Know It All]

It appears in the restoration of older plywood boats at least, CPES has proven to be a pretty good product, used properly for the right reasons. Although it seems expensive, it appears to be an importaint step in gaining good results with keeping at least some of the boat "original" wood and helps preserve any new wood you add to the boat. That is what I am hearing and seeing from other wooden boat friends. What do you hear and see?
Peace---> Kevin in Ohio

[Mr. Know It All]

It appears in the restoration of older plywood boats at least, CPES has proven to be a pretty good product, used properly for the right reasons. Although it seems expensive, it appears to be an importaint step in gaining good results with keeping at least some of the boat "original" wood and helps preserve any new wood you add to the boat. That is what I am hearing and seeing from other wooden boat friends. What do you hear and see?
Peace---> Kevin in Ohio

[paul oman]

Similar products, different testing, different point of view. Visit
http://www.epoxyproducts.com/penetrating4u.html

penetrating epoxies (http://www.epoxyproducts.com/penetrating4u.html)

cheers

paul

[paul oman]

Similar products, different testing, different point of view. Visit
http://www.epoxyproducts.com/penetrating4u.html

penetrating epoxies (http://www.epoxyproducts.com/penetrating4u.html)

cheers

paul

[paul oman]

Similar products, different testing, different point of view. Visit
http://www.epoxyproducts.com/penetrating4u.html

penetrating epoxies (http://www.epoxyproducts.com/penetrating4u.html)

cheers

paul

[Wooden Boat Fittings]

CPES isn't a general panacea for rot. It certainly won't cure rot -- the only "cure" is removal. But once you've removed any rotten material, a good soaking of the sound timber with CPES can stop rot from renewing its toe-hold.

An added bonus of CPES is that it toughens up the timber surface, giving better protection against dings. (We use it on our boathook shafts for that reason.)

But like all epoxies, nor does CPES have u/v resistance. So unless it's protected it will break down in sunlight. Once that process starts, it's rot-protection properties also start to wane. So you need to protect CPES-treated timber from the light (usually with paint or varnish) in order to maintain its rot protection.

I don't know about >70% Norm, but it certainly contains a high proportion of solvents. They're pretty potent, too. If you're using the stuff you really need to be outside in the open air if you can, and anyway wearing breathing protection.

I understand that the epoxy is actually dissolved in a mix of wood-derived resins and does indeed get carried into the timber structure with them. Since penetration is due to capillary action, the more you can apply before it goes off, the further into the timber it's likely to soak.

Used within its limitations, I think CPES is a great (albeit pricey) product.

Mike
.

[Wooden Boat Fittings]

CPES isn't a general panacea for rot. It certainly won't cure rot -- the only "cure" is removal. But once you've removed any rotten material, a good soaking of the sound timber with CPES can stop rot from renewing its toe-hold.

An added bonus of CPES is that it toughens up the timber surface, giving better protection against dings. (We use it on our boathook shafts for that reason.)

But like all epoxies, nor does CPES have u/v resistance. So unless it's protected it will break down in sunlight. Once that process starts, it's rot-protection properties also start to wane. So you need to protect CPES-treated timber from the light (usually with paint or varnish) in order to maintain its rot protection.

I don't know about >70% Norm, but it certainly contains a high proportion of solvents. They're pretty potent, too. If you're using the stuff you really need to be outside in the open air if you can, and anyway wearing breathing protection.

I understand that the epoxy is actually dissolved in a mix of wood-derived resins and does indeed get carried into the timber structure with them. Since penetration is due to capillary action, the more you can apply before it goes off, the further into the timber it's likely to soak.

Used within its limitations, I think CPES is a great (albeit pricey) product.

Mike
.

[Wooden Boat Fittings]

CPES isn't a general panacea for rot. It certainly won't cure rot -- the only "cure" is removal. But once you've removed any rotten material, a good soaking of the sound timber with CPES can stop rot from renewing its toe-hold.

An added bonus of CPES is that it toughens up the timber surface, giving better protection against dings. (We use it on our boathook shafts for that reason.)

But like all epoxies, nor does CPES have u/v resistance. So unless it's protected it will break down in sunlight. Once that process starts, it's rot-protection properties also start to wane. So you need to protect CPES-treated timber from the light (usually with paint or varnish) in order to maintain its rot protection.

I don't know about >70% Norm, but it certainly contains a high proportion of solvents. They're pretty potent, too. If you're using the stuff you really need to be outside in the open air if you can, and anyway wearing breathing protection.

I understand that the epoxy is actually dissolved in a mix of wood-derived resins and does indeed get carried into the timber structure with them. Since penetration is due to capillary action, the more you can apply before it goes off, the further into the timber it's likely to soak.

Used within its limitations, I think CPES is a great (albeit pricey) product.

Mike
.

[Wild Dingo]

Heres a question...

If I go build me canoes or a "elf" design of Oughtreds... if I whack the ply and timber through CPES before I do any cutting then once done building do the epoxy and glass thing? Do I need to do so if Im encapsulating? that is one load of straight epoxy first to soak into the timber and then epoxy float coat then glass and more poxy do I need the CPES or not if I go this route?

Mike do you know the cost of this stuff here?

[ 01-19-2003, 08:46 AM: Message edited by: Wild Dingo ]

[Wild Dingo]

Heres a question...

If I go build me canoes or a "elf" design of Oughtreds... if I whack the ply and timber through CPES before I do any cutting then once done building do the epoxy and glass thing? Do I need to do so if Im encapsulating? that is one load of straight epoxy first to soak into the timber and then epoxy float coat then glass and more poxy do I need the CPES or not if I go this route?

Mike do you know the cost of this stuff here?

[ 01-19-2003, 08:46 AM: Message edited by: Wild Dingo ]

[Wild Dingo]

Heres a question...

If I go build me canoes or a "elf" design of Oughtreds... if I whack the ply and timber through CPES before I do any cutting then once done building do the epoxy and glass thing? Do I need to do so if Im encapsulating? that is one load of straight epoxy first to soak into the timber and then epoxy float coat then glass and more poxy do I need the CPES or not if I go this route?

Mike do you know the cost of this stuff here?

[ 01-19-2003, 08:46 AM: Message edited by: Wild Dingo ]

[Mike Field]

I can't help you with the first part of the question Shane, but I think I paid about $60 for a half-gallon of the stuff. Tony will be able to tell us if he chances along.

[Mike Field]

I can't help you with the first part of the question Shane, but I think I paid about $60 for a half-gallon of the stuff. Tony will be able to tell us if he chances along.

[Mike Field]

I can't help you with the first part of the question Shane, but I think I paid about $60 for a half-gallon of the stuff. Tony will be able to tell us if he chances along.

[NormMessinger]

If you want opinion and not rigorously tested knowledge you've come to the right place.

Putting CPES on the sheets before the parts are cut out wastes CPES. Why googue scrap. Besides the cut edges are then left un treated.

Putting CPES under perfectly good epoxy is a waste of CPES. Laminating epoxy penetrates and sticks as good as it need to.

CPES is an undercoat and sealer for finishing, Rot Dr.'s attempt to sell more of the stuff not withstanding.

I buy CPES by the pint. Anyone who buys it by the gallon feel free to step in here. tongue.gif

[NormMessinger]

If you want opinion and not rigorously tested knowledge you've come to the right place.

Putting CPES on the sheets before the parts are cut out wastes CPES. Why googue scrap. Besides the cut edges are then left un treated.

Putting CPES under perfectly good epoxy is a waste of CPES. Laminating epoxy penetrates and sticks as good as it need to.

CPES is an undercoat and sealer for finishing, Rot Dr.'s attempt to sell more of the stuff not withstanding.

I buy CPES by the pint. Anyone who buys it by the gallon feel free to step in here. tongue.gif

[NormMessinger]

If you want opinion and not rigorously tested knowledge you've come to the right place.

Putting CPES on the sheets before the parts are cut out wastes CPES. Why googue scrap. Besides the cut edges are then left un treated.

Putting CPES under perfectly good epoxy is a waste of CPES. Laminating epoxy penetrates and sticks as good as it need to.

CPES is an undercoat and sealer for finishing, Rot Dr.'s attempt to sell more of the stuff not withstanding.

I buy CPES by the pint. Anyone who buys it by the gallon feel free to step in here. tongue.gif