Pulling the Head

[Concordia41]

Other than rubber gloves, bleach, and generally just psyching myself up not to loose my lunch, are there any words of wisdom/experience you gentlemen can provide.

When we got her a year ago, there were "presents" in the bowl so I'm sure the lines and everything else are quite gross. But the time has come and my general plan of attack is to start by removing the fitting that goes into the macerator (most accessable) capping that as best as possible for control and then figuring it out as I go along. (Not much of a plan huh?) It'd be nice if I could get a little gravity on my side and drain everything out into a bucket, but everything is 95% horizontal and we will not, I repeat WILL NOT try to start a hose pipe siphon.

Thanks!

- M

Maybe SM (Smelly Margo) by day's end...

[paladin]

Check e-mail

[Ian McColgin]

Flush a lot with something violently aromatic - Lysol, Simple Green etc, - mixed with some Ivory.

Try unhooking things in a big a bundle as possible - like the head and the immediatly attendent hoses - and (have a friend to help and keeping the free hose ends high) run the mess out on deck quickly.

Dispose of the macerator properly. Things are about worthless anyway.

Hoses get a lot of salt build up any you may as well prepare to replace just about everything.

I still love my LeVac and have a huge holding tank but when I rebuild Grana I'll be putting in a second head, more to have easy sitting on either tack but partly to alleviate congestion, and am planning around the little extra space it takes to go composting. Some finastkind units now available, at least for yachts over 12T or so with a little space to swing a cat. . .

G'luck

[Matt J.]

Paladin,
w/o intruding on privacy, would it be innappropriate to ask if your email includes instructive advice? If so, is it possible for you to drop me the note as well? You see, we'll be removing and replacing the head eventually, too, and I'd like to put any advice in our project book for future reference. Not trying to be nosy, but this question had crossed my mind, too - how the heck to remove the system?

Thanks.

[Concordia41]

Thanks guys. Didn't get more than the door to the head off today because I'd forgotten I had volunteer help this morning. Granted, it'd be good to have a second hand helping with this, but in the interest of having my volunteer continue to volunteer I changed tacks to the relative safety of removing cabinets and ceiling boards.

Paladinsfo's e-mail contained a simple plan to scuttle the entire project. He e-mailed it because he knew I wouldn't do it and he didn't want to be a bad influence on anyone with a little too much frustration on their plate.

Ian - It currently isn't flushable. Lever has been jammed since day one. However, on further consideration and factoring all the work involved combined with the almost certainty of disaster, I'm going to dedicate some time to making it workable and following your advice. The thought of all of that going in the bilge is just unbearable! Granted it wouldn't stay there long with the planks we've got off, but still...

We're at least a year away from needing a working replacement so I've got time to make a MSD decision. When I first saw the Lectra-San I thought it was a good thing - I remember it being a pretty expensive system in its day, but The Husband says that among other things it pulls way too much power. The hoses look pretty new but, I'm not cleaning and storing this mess for a year or more just to probably go replace it all anyway. The throne's a keeper though...it's not a Baby Blake (though my heart yearns for one) but it's a nice old fashioned porcelain number.

Thanks! Here's to another day without having to bathe in Lysol http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/wink.gif

[paladin]

I purchased my Baby Blake in the U.K. and had it delivered to the airport, about $400 U.S. and the duty in the States was about $26 as I recall, a lot cheaper than Defender or Luke.....But I travelled a lot...
It is true that the Lectra San pulls a lot of current but not a lot of power. I forget the number of amps but at 12 volts the watts are calculated in wtts per second or watt hours by multiplying the amps by volts times seconds....the actual time the current is being drawn is relatively short times the number of flushes per day and you can calculated the watt hours.....then see if your battery will handle it. In a reasonable amount of sunlight you can restore the lost energy with a solar panel......if you are considering an Electra San I'll work up some numbers if you like.......Chuck

[David Tabor (sailordave)]

You mentioned "stuff" in the hoses. Have you tried pouring vinegar into the bowl and pumping throoouuugh the system and then letting it SIT. Supposedly it dissolves some of the attached crud and keeps things clean on the inside. Hey I know more than a few folks who swear by it. Worth a couple $$$'s of vinegar to see if it cleans it out.

[Mike Field]

Margo, for what it's worth, I was a sewerage maintenance engineer in a former existence, and my experience is, once you're in the stuff sh*t is just sh*t. Not pleasant of course, but the thought is usually a good deal worse than the fact.

Here's a story to point that up. When people asked me what my job was in those days, I usually got a "Yuk" reaction when I told them. Then I'd go on to say, "Well, it might be sh*t to you, but it's my bread-and-butter."

I used to get enormous enjoyment out of the reactions to that..... http://www.duhspot.com/users/smiley/s/cwm/3dlil/puke.gif

[This message has been edited by Mike Field (edited 08-15-2001).]

[PugetSound]

Back when I was working in the ER, we would occasionally have to help some person who was in an extreme state of neglect (usually homeless). The smell was something awful and we would fight it by wearing surgical masks with oil-of-wintergreen or some such on the mask. You couldn't smell anything but that oil.

[This message has been edited by PugetSound (edited 08-16-2001).]

[Nora Lee]

Margo & others!

On July 4th hubby Jon decided that our head needed to be lifted and taken home to do a rebuild. He successfully removed the head and hoses with no sewage in the bilge. He loaded the head in our truck "George" and drove out of the marina forgetting that the tail gate was not in place. He gunned the engine to get out on the causeway and out slide our Rariton, to shatter on the road.

The following day, I bought a Sanipotti and the installation was just setting it in place. No hoses, No major moving parts, self contained holding tank,( may be installed permanently with y valve) and not much odor unless full.

We may just leave this as our permanent solution, less to go wrong. It gets carried off once a week, to be dumped down a toilet at a marina or overboard where legal.

Not what we had planned but certainly working for us now!

Good Luck,

Nora

[ken mcclure]

Just be sure to consider the health issues. E. Coli is not an animal to fool with. Be sure to wear protective gear, including eye protection. Wear a respirator just to protect your mouth and nose from any "splashes" that might happen. If anyone takes a break to eat or smoke a cigarette, be sure they wash their hands thoroughly with an antibacterial soap.

Good luck!

[paladin]

I just checked out the Lectra San as far as power consumption goes, I had one about 20 years ago and couldn't find fault with it and did not remember it as a power hog...
The operating cycle is factory adjusted to 10 seconds. At 12 volts d.c. it will use 1.7 watt hours of power, or a very small toyota starting battery will yield about 40 flushes a day without recharging. In total energy output usage it will probably be one of the lowest powered devices on your boat...jus some info for you.......

[TomRobb]

Am I missing something here? To be sure E.Coli aren't mighty good eatin' But anyone who's raised a baby knows it isn't exactly plutonium or Eboli (sp?) virus either. Soap and water will get rid of it. You don't need a positive pressure CDC contagion suit http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/rolleyes.gif

[This message has been edited by TomRobb (edited 08-16-2001).]

[Mike Field]

Actually, E Coli isn't itself a problem -- quite harmless, in fact. But being always present in the human gut (as well as other places,) it's an excellent indicator that other, less innocuous, bugs might also be around.

Washing up carefully with soap is sound enough practice. But a bit of household disinfectant in the water certainly wouldn't go stray if you had any. Or being as it's summer where you are (you lucky people,) you could just go for a dip in a chlorinated pool,,,,

[ken mcclure]

LOL! As to the contagion suit, it really depends on who was using the unit before, and on your own susceptibility. The fact that there's stuff clogged in there leads me to believe that there is a collection, possibly from several people. While my own collection of critters in my own gut is no problem to me, someone else's could well be just as mine could be to them. It's not a situation to panic over, it's just another one of those "better safe than sorry" things.

[Noah]

Now that you have conquered that mess I will relate my story of opening up a clogged sewer main inside my old house that is on the city sewer line.

Things got clogged up, and I decided to take a look. Without realizing that the toilet and shower were a good 7 ft above the drain cap that I was looking into, I opened the system up...
I remember a couple of things. The first was a face full of "water", the second was falling back looking at a 3ft geyser, and the 3rd was realizing that I really needed to get the cap back on. I was starting to panic thinking about the whole street flooding my basement and all my tools, when I finally got the thing back on.

I came up the stairs covered in stuff, and jumped into the shower with all my clothes on. After about 45 minutes of really hot water I felt ready to meet the world again.

I called my dad, and strangely enough he had done the exact same thing 20 years earlier. We are both smart enough to know better, but I guess it makes for a good story. I can almost laugh about it now. Except for my roommate having just used the toilet...

Noah

[Concordia41]

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1668945&a=13310177&p=53185169

Success!

The job was made much easier by two things: 1. Dave getting a couple of the planks off, which eliminated any real danger in case of a spill; and 2. The advice to run vinegar through the system, which helped smell wise and when I did have seepage, it was mainly vinegarish. -
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Total time involved: 2 hours 15 minutes-
Time actually spent with a tool in hand - maybe an hour-
Time spent "pondering" - about 40 minutes -
Time wasted trying something different before going back to what I was doing in the first place- 25 minutes-
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I put one of our plastic recycling bins on the ground directly underneath. Seemed like the right thing to do and it actually did catch a lot of the liquid that went out. It also "caught" my 7/16" socket and 1/2" wrench http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/frown.gif -
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Most valuable tools - Short wrench set and hacksaw-
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The hose clamps were relatively new and all but one loosened with a screwdriver, but I still had a hard time getting some of the hoses off. As we were going to be replacing the hoses anyway, thanks to Mr. Hacksaw, it didn't matter if the hoses came off or not. If I had to do it again (and wasn't going to reuse the hoses), I'd just cut them in the first place and worry about the hose clams when everything was out and on the ground.
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Bright idea I wouldn't do again - After getting the hose clamps off but before resorting to the hacksaw, I reasoned that since the hoses were so rigid a few well placed blows with a hammer would loosen the connections. Don't know if it loosened it at all, but it sure sprayed the contents of the hose out around the connection. And of course, you can guess where my face was. It was one of those slow motion things, and I couldn't get out of the way fast enough BLEEEAKK! http://media5.hypernet.com/~dick/ubb/frown.gif -
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Also, couldn't have lived without:
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About 10 disposable gloves-
2 towels - one for messes, one to set tools on-
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And most of all, the whole process was made brighter by constantly thinking about getting home, getting in the shower, and getting on line with the results. -

Thanks for all your help!

And for the Martha Stewart types and all others grossed out by the bowl.

TA DA!
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1668945&a=13310177&p=53185170

[This message has been edited by Concordia41 (edited 08-23-2001).]

[Nora Lee]

Margo,

Ala Martha Stewart, if you want to use the head for a dual purpose, why not plant some posies in it (pot and all) until you reinstall? It will brighten up the boat yard.

As Captain Jon was unloading our Rariton he had it sitting aft of the cockpi, waiting for the rivers fetch to calm down. A fellow boater came down the dock, and Jon announced that he had been busy installing a poop deck!

Glad your project didn't turn into a sewage nightmare, I am sure you had a few of those anticipating the job.

Regards,

Nora

[ken mcclure]

Definitely put some flowers in or something, especially if there are kids around. My 3-year-old daughter was on a trip with me to the plumbing supply store. As I was standing at the counter waiting for the clerk to locate a couple of "O"-rings for me, I turned around to see my daughter dropping her pants in preparation for climbing up on one of the display toilets....

I almost dropped her for the laughing as I grabbed her and carried her at a run with her pants around her knees to the restroom.

[dasboat]

KW,that is so funny!
Years ago Nan and I were at sears to buy a washer. We saw a litle girl just sliding off the seat and proudly proclaiming her achievment, as her parents flashed an embarrased grin.
The salesperson looked at us and sighed,"it happens about once a week."
Das

[This message has been edited by dasboat (edited 08-21-2001).]