Forekeel progress - need bolt advice

[Rich VanValkenburg]

I've spent hours going back through as many of the old posts as I could find about this, but didn't see a way through yet so I thought I'd try again.

Here's a cross-section of the old forekeel at the point where the a bolt passes through the forekeel and up into the floors and mast step. The longest bolt is about 12". I want to replace the steel bolts with bronze, but the head is a problem. From the old posts, it sounds like welding isn't the way to go since it wrecks the temper of the bronze. Beating a head like this out of 1/2" bronze rod doesn't seem like a possiblity, so what are your opinions? The cross section shows the 1/2" wide flat across the bottom for the brass shoe.
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid19/p9c47d9e799d31843e1916096e1ba6803/fdc5b37c.jpg
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid19/p98d40e96b39b144d607d70c0632ef39c/fdc5b25a.jpg
I thought about just using a round washer and standard hex nut, but the hole needed will be wider than the 1/2" shoe. Need some help here. Everything is about ready to go together, but this is a problem for me.

[Ed Harrow]

Rich, I'm going to be away from my usual resources for the rest of the week, but will check in with them when I get back. Have you discussed this with Atlas (they advertise in our sponsor's magazine). Might a simple L head do the trick? Given the different strengths of the material, perhaps you may need to make some adjustments? Do you have a smithy about in your neck of the woods? Do a search on Martell Metals, tell Marty I sent you (he'll double his price) and tell him that yes, since I've found the back way around the worst of the RT 95 bottleneck I WILL get down to see him.

[Ruaridh]

Have you considered getting a standard hex nut, then getting the outside of it machined round to the exact size of the head you would like? If it turned out to be too thin-walled, you could go down a size with the threads on the bronze rod, as long as you thought this wouldn't affect the strength too much.

As everything would be brand new, it would be easy to tighten this sufficiently with a pipe wrench or similar, and you could use thread-locking compound or even cross-drill and pin with a small bronze pin to make sure it can never turn.

You could even get some flats milled on the sides if it is still too wide, although then you'd almost definitely have to go down in thread size, which you might not want to do.

Regards,
Ruaridh.

[stef]

Hi Rich:

Have you contacted any local blacksmiths or ferriers? They would have the skills and tools to do a job for this scale.

There was a post a while back on a similar problem with a bent bronze rudder.

Stefan

[Stan Derelian]

I understand that there are some forgeable bronzes. Whether they would be suitable for marine use, I don't know. One place to check is the local art foundry. A sculptor that works in bronze could probably give you an answer.

[Concordia..41]

Rich –

The bolt in the picture appears to have been made from a square head bolt with the two sides cut off to form the “T” head.

You may be able to find square head ½” bronze bolts to make the new bolts out of. I have found a few square head bronze machine bolts in the past. I know where there are a lot of square-head bronze lag bolts. Check with Standard Fasteners and see if they may have them or maybe can get them from one of their suppliers.

Ed has a good suggestion in making an “L” head out of bronze rod. I don’t know what the floor spacing is in this area, but it seems to me that ½” bolts seem over built and smaller ones could be used.

I would use 7/16" or 3/8" bronze rod and thread it to the length of the nut. Peen the end of the rod to prevent the nut from backing off. Counter sink the hole just under size of the of the hex nut as this will hold the nut from turn when it is driven or pulled into the hole and deep enough to be plugged. Use a small amount of cotton on the rod behind the nut and use Dolphinite for bedding. Use thickened epoxy to install the plug, which will help keep the wood from splitting in this area. Avoid installing plank fasteners at this point if possible.

Dave
Sun over foreyard

[Rich VanValkenburg]

Ya know, I thought about using 3/8" rod to keep the size of the nut down, but wasn't sure it'd be stronger enough. Sonja is a pretty light-built boat. Frames are 1" square on 7" centers, with a floor every other frame. In the area of the forekeel floors, the bolt goes up and through a 4' long mast step timber, so there's some added stress there. You think 3/8" bronze would do it?

3/8" would solve the problem, as would an L bolt. I'll poke around for square heads. Thanks!

Rich

[brian.cunningham]

:cool: autopsy photos!

[GondolaGuy]

If you want a bronze fastening that is 12 inches long and 1/2 inch diamater with a T head, the simplest thing is to take a carriage bolt, lay it on its side on an anvel, and beat the side of the head until it is the same width as the shaft. You can get 1/2" x 12" bronze carriage bolts from Jamestown Distributors, catalog no. FSBCB12X12. Don't make your life more complicated then it has to be. ;)

Thom
Venice, Italy

[Rich VanValkenburg]

GondolaGuy, How could it possibly be that easy? LOL! I gave up looking in the easy places. They got 'em up to 14".

Rich