questions about strip planking

[pdag]

Hi,
When it comes to strip planking, how do you estimate the amount of lumber you need to buy?

Thanks

[James R]

Well when building a canoe I measure the girth of the largest frame. Let's say that it measures 60" and each strip is 1" in width, then I'll need 60 strips. Not all of the strips need to be full length but I assume that they do and cut up a few extra just in case. Yes, I always have a few left over. It's a quick and dirty way of doing it but it works well for me. When calculating the number of board feet of roughsawn lumber that you need don't forget to take into account the amount of sawdust that you'll make. If you're cutting 1/4" strips and the kerf of your blade is 1/8" then you'll need 50% more lumber.

If you're building something larger I guess you could figure out the surface area of the hull and calculate the number of strips from that adding maybe 15% for waste.

[ 03-06-2004, 12:14 AM: Message edited by: James R ]

[Venchka]

Originally posted by James R:
...Not all of the strips need to be full length but I assume that they do and cut up a few extra just in case.

Hijack! Cut the strips how? From what size stock? What kind of wood? What grain orientation?

Enquiring minds want to know.

[James R]

Originally posted by Venchka:
Hijack! Cut the strips how? From what size stock? What kind of wood? What grain orientation?

Enquiring minds want to know.I usually buy rough flatsawn 4/4 western red cedar 17' in length and in random widths (often 10" or so). I put it through the thickness planer and can sometimes get it to 7/8" but usually 3/4". I dress one edge and rip the boards into 1/4" thick strips. The flatsawn boards then become quartersawn strips. I've used a table saw but most of the time use a bandsaw because of the much thinner kerf. I use homemade extension tables and a long fence. It's not that I'm cheap but I just hate watching all that wood turned into sawdust.

[Venchka]

Originally posted by James R:
...It's not that I'm cheap but I just hate watching all that wood turned into sawdust.I hear ya! Thanks!

[Ron Williamson]

Don't you lose what you were trying to save,in planing?
R

[George Roberts]

Venchka and in part to Ron Williamson ---

I have taken to buying rough sawn 4x6x10's.

If I do everthing right, I can bandsaw a 4x6 into 14 strips and thickness sand to 1/8". Then I can use a table saw to rip the strips to the desired width.

One 4x6x10' will cover about 50 sq ft.

While I used to believe that a bandsaw would produce more material, from my figures above the waste is 1/8" per bandsaw cut. Using a .075" circular saw and thickness sanding, I get about the same waste, but I cannot resaw 6" material with a circular saw.

The quality of the strips is best if the material is ripped into 4 strip thicknesses, sanded on the sawn faces, ripped to 2 strip thicknesses, sanded on the sawn faces, ripped to 1 strip thickness, and finish sanded.

[James R]

Ron, I'm only cutting through 3/4" thick lumber so I end up with a nearly smooth cut that doesn't need to be sanded or planed. I've used different blades over the years but my favourite is a carbide tipped blade that leaves a .056" kerf. That .056" is all I lose which gives me 5 or 6 more strips per board.

George, if I understand you correctly you're talking about producing 1/8" veneers for cold-molding. I was talking about 1/4"x3/4" strips for strip planking. For small quantities of veneer I'd probably resaw as well (haven't we talked about this before?) but for larger quantities sliced veneer would be best. The waste is virtually nil.

[George Roberts]

James R ---

No James, I was talking about cutting strips for strip boats. I use 1/8" x 3/4" (more or less) strips. (Slicing veneer is a wonderful idea. I lack the tooling.)

I understand that different people use different methods of measuring board yield and strip thickness.

When I used a thin circular saw blade, I believed it was superior to bandsaws. When I used bandsaws, I believed they were superior. Over time I have come to believe that the only way you get an extra strip by one method is to make the finished (on the hull and faired) strip thinner than the other method.

[Tom Lathrop]

I use a thin "planer" type blade that is 7 1/2" diameter on a table saw to cut strips for canoes. These blades have no set in the teeth but the blade thickness is tapered thinner toward the center and make very smooth cuts. If done correctly, the strips come out very uniform with surfaces so smooth that no other work need be done. The blades don't last long but are cheap from the local hardware and can be sharpened if you have the patience. I think I get better use out of the stock with this method than a bandsaw on narrow width strips.

For wider resaws, the bandsaw is better but much slower and more difficult to set up.

[Venchka]

Originally posted by Tom Lathrop:
I use a thin "planer" type blade that is 7 1/2" diameter on a table saw to cut strips for canoes.

Tom,

Would the same blade work for thicker strips, say 1/2" to 5/8" for a larger boat? Would you happen to have a manufacturer or model number and perhaps the number of teeth? Inventory can vary a lot from one local hardware store to the next. I would like to know that I am buying a similar blade.

[Tom Lathrop]

Can't help on the brand but I'm certain that they were bought at the local building supply that has an ACE Hardware department. I guess typical would be Vermont American. I don't think they are anything special, just look for one with the tapered thickness. Less than $10, I think. Most of the strips were cut from 3/4 inch material. As others have said, you will often need to start with other dimension stock.

[Venchka]

Thanks, Tom.

[George Roberts]

Venchka ---

The trade name for that blade is "hollow ground planer."

It is HSS not carbide tipped. Dewalt also make one.

[Clifton Brittain]

I bought 2 Woodworker II blades and put a spacer between them, then set the fence an equal distance from the inner blade.

Love those blades and made the strips twice as fast. If I'd have had a longer arbor, I would have kept stackin' em up.

I was going to glue & nail the strips & fair the hull, cover it with fiberglass and paint it, so I wasn't fussy about the edges.

I used the estimating method mentioned in the first reply, and added 15%. Didn't need more than 2%. I have a lot of really long, sweet-smelling stir sticks now.

[Tom Lathrop]

Clifton,

How did you handle the issue of getting the center strip through the blades safely. Can be done, of course but you have over $200 in the blades and a lot more waste. Forrest blades are very good but other less expensive ones are in the same quality range. When there is inevitable shaping or sanding required after glue-up, the extra smooth surface doesn't mean much.

Cutting long strips is really a two person job since readjusting a featherboard for each cut is a real bother. I suppose the other human featherboard can run out to the end and pull the strips through when you are near the end of the cut.

One problem I have had with Forrest blades is that the sides of the carbide tips have very little relief and can burn hard or resinous woods when ripping.

A couple of other things to keep in mind when doing a lot of continuous cutting:

Cutting so much work can overheat a small tablesaw motor so you should check on that occasionally.

If tablesaw blades get too hot they will warp and not only ruin the cut but greatly increase the chance of a bad kickback. A great reason to have a knee or foot operated kill switch handy when both hands are busy and you need to shut down.

[ 03-08-2004, 08:59 AM: Message edited by: Tom Lathrop ]

[pdag]

Hi,
What is the gerth of the boat? Is that another name for beam?

Thanks

[Venchka]

The distance around the largest part of the hull from sheer to sheer. Like your girth around the middle, except you only go halfway. It's a function of beam, depth and hull shape.

[Sheister]

Planer blades are perfect for this use, as they will cut as smooth as you can sand and save a bunch of work later. The only thing to be careful of is the fact that planer blades work best when they are raised all the way up so you are cutting as close to the hub as possible.This is usually explained on the labels for these type of blades, but seems counterintuitive. This exposes a lot of blade, so you need to be very careful or have a blade guard in place at all times, which is tough on such a thin cut.
BTW, I'm thinking about getting into my first stripper canoe. What is the usual thickness used for strips on these boats? I'm seeing some saying 1/8" and others saying 1/4"? I'd like to know how much cedar I need to order to start ripping strips for my project. TIA- Bob

[James R]

Sheister, 1/4" is standard. Once you finish planking the hull you'll need to do some planing and sanding. 1/8" would be much too thin. As a matter of fact I'm curious as to what George is building with 1/8" strips. George?

[George Roberts]

James R ---

You wrote:

"As a matter of fact I'm curious as to what George is building with 1/8" strips. George?"

I build kayaks/canoes with them. It is amazing how much different a boat looks when all of the material for the deck or the hull comes from a single board and is kept in order.

The following link is a hull from 4x6 WRC:

www.robertscpa.com/kayaks/hull_book_match.jpg (http://www.robertscpa.com/kayaks/hull_book_match.jpg)

The following link is a deck from 2x6 Redwood:

http://www.robertscpa.com/kayaks/deck_sanded.jpg