Rigging question

[KNOCKABOUT]

So I'll be launching my CC Knockabout this weekend, and I'm very excited about this - but in reviewing my standing rigging something looks amiss... I cant for the life of me figure out how I would rig a spinnie on the existing standing rigging?! The standing rigging is as follows:

Two aft swivel blocks port and stbd, which basically make up the traveler, jam cleats port and stbd, as well as leads, and two cleats on the cuddy for the main, cunningham and jib.

So...

How does the spinnie get rigged without an additional block aft?

[Hwyl]

KNOCKABOUT (http://www.woodenboatvb.com/www/vbulletin/upload/member.php?u=11923)
Photographer


Do what your moniker says, and take some pictures.

Are you sure the "aft swivel blocks" are for the traveller?

[KNOCKABOUT]

KNOCKABOUT (http://www.woodenboatvb.com/www/vbulletin/upload/member.php?u=11923)
Photographer


Do what your moniker says, and take some pictures.

Are you sure the "aft swivel blocks" are for the traveller?

Yes good point... I will take pictures. I assume the swivel blocks are for the traveller yes, as she sports no vang... she's old, pretty, but old, and I believe older rigging plans had the mainsheet through both swivel blocks back to a hanging block on the boom and down to a cleat amidships.

She has an awfully large canvas, which is why I believe the blocks are neccesary for the main... I'll take some pics (god you wouldn't believe what a production that is for me), but how else would she rig if not through the swivel blocks with no vang?

Just went out and checked the rig again... and the swivels are certainly for the main. I guess I'll just throw in additional cleats on the afterdeck.

[Ian McColgin]

It may not be in time for your launch, but I'll try to sail by some Knockabouts today or tomorrow and look at how they are rigged.

Our old family Knockabout had a pipe horse for a traveler and we never flew a spinnaker. I've not looked closely at this in the modern (post WWII, mostly glass) boats up here where they are ment to sail.

By the way, lovely boats that they are, growing up in one in the Dead Sea (Long Island Sound) was frustrating. They need some air to really show how good they are.

[George.]

I thought a knockabout was a schooner with no bowsprit. :confused:

[KNOCKABOUT]

It may not be in time for your launch, but I'll try to sail by some Knockabouts today or tomorrow and look at how they are rigged.

Our old family Knockabout had a pipe horse for a traveler and we never flew a spinnaker. I've not looked closely at this in the modern (post WWII, mostly glass) boats up here where they are ment to sail.

By the way, lovely boats that they are, growing up in one in the Dead Sea (Long Island Sound) was frustrating. They need some air to really show how good they are.

Thank you Ian. I believe I have the rigging down, but do not understand where the spinnie halyard is rigged nor how it would be stowed as well as how one would secure a symmetrical without using those aft swivels which are most assuredly for the traveler...

[KNOCKABOUT]

I thought a knockabout was a schooner with no bowsprit. :confused:

True, but there was a one design class... in fact the first one design class was a Gurney designed boat - called a knockabout. It long held the distinction of being the largest one design fleet built over a single mould. There are not many original woodies around anymore (or at least I had a devil of a time scoring my 194* (2,6, or 8, take a guess, I have documentation suggesting each year...). And as Ian noted they sail like hogs in dull wind - but are fun as hell in a blow. A very stable boat designed for short coastal daysailing. Unfortunately I will have her on the Hudson, but thats perfect for teaching my kids to sail and handle a boat properly. They're just little pishers now, but soon enough I'll have myself a crew...http://www.woodenboatvb.com/www/vbulletin/upload/images/icons/icon11.gif

[Ian McColgin]

I could not get to the computer earlier - busy race schedule and all - but I've had a good look at our local Knockabouts all doing great deeds in their home waters.

They all have aluminum spars and mid-boom sheeting. The more modern glass boats have a bridge deck with traveler. The older ones have a pivoting block and cam cleat on the cockpit sole just abaft the centerboard trunk. Either way vanges the sail about equally well on the wind and equally ineffectivly off the wind.

If you have a wooden boom, you'll likely need to go with end-boom sheeting. Make a rod horse for that - easy, cheap and traditional.

But the aluminum spars are incredible. It was a good fresh to strong breeze (Force 5 to Force 6 mostly 20kt with some sustained bits a little over 25kt) and the mid-boom sheeting allowed some impressive boom bending to flatten the sail.

In racing, what with most spinnaker sets being starboard tack, the chute is under the port side of the deck and launched over the combing abaft the shroud. The halyard, sheet and guy are just led around and under there in the usual small boat manner. Many leave the pole rigged throughout the race to avoid putting anyone on the foredeck during the race and save some time. When the spinnaker is not set and ready, the halyard is just clipped to the mast car that otherwise holds the pole, as are the pole's down-haul and topping lift. During the races I did not see where the spinnaker halyard's fall led to.

I observed on a couple of boats just hacking about, no race, that all the halyards led to the mast just above the partners. This can be reached from the cockpit.

The spinnaker halyard block is above the jib stay, just a little.

Sorry this was not more timely for you.

G'luck

[KNOCKABOUT]

Ian, thank you. As it turns out my progeny each came down with their own distinct sneezing, coughing, runny-nose-fever thing, so I postponed launching to this coming weekend. So in fact, you are as timely as ever, and I appreciate your observations...

So to recap, my boom is wooden, and your suggestion is to add a horse rod for the traveler and leave the swivels for spinnie work? As it is now, the boom is supported both aft as well as amidship by virtue of the sheet passing through the blocks and back up through and half way down the boom amidship just aft of the CB trunk as you pointed out. And I believe this to be a fairly typical "old style" rigging plan. And one I think neccesary for the strength of these old booms is somewhat suspect... What I was curious about is how one would control the spinnie (i.e. where would the sheet be secured to? As I could imagine the afterguy could be handled freely by a crew member... had you seen this done?). Incidentally, do you know any of these crazy CC Knockabout drivers? Think you could make an introduction for a somewhat southerly member of this old fleet?

Thanks again

[Ian McColgin]

As a quickest fix, I might make a horse from a bit os ss tubing let into a wood block held in place with a U bolt over the tube and through the deck and backing pad. All to land inside the spinnaker turning blocks, mabe about even with the combing sides. Pretty easy - maybe an hour of work.

Have a shackle that fits over the tubing and you're all set. By the way, the shackle will run more easily if the pin side is down. It can bind if the U side is around the tubing, though that at first appears neater. It can't hurt to put a bushing over the pin. You may also want to work in a rubber washer (bit of old tire or something) for each end to reduce banging.

Generally the purchase is at the end with just one line going to mid-boom and down to the block and cleat. When we were growing up, Mother did not like that at all and just led the sheet from the block on the horse straight to her hand. Dad made a little V groove in the tiller end to work as a keep one thumb over it jam cleat.

Both for riding horses and handling the tiller, Mother had the most sensitive hands I've ever known. We never had telltails or a mast fly as Mom would just feel the right trim and she could coax an extra tenth of a knot with very subtle trim adjustments.

I don't know the local folk personally but surely there's a class association you can google up. There's one family I see knockingabout - heheheh - a lot and I'll hail them next time. The kids - a gang of 16 year olds three guys and three gals - were goofing off in the Cove Friday looking cool. Very short spinnaker sets then three or four wold dive off and swim about while the others ran down the cove, doused the chute, and came back plucking them on the fly.

As the Duke said in "True Grit"

Reminds me . . .

. . . of me.