Considering purchase, need help

[Spokaloo]

What kind of disaster am I trying to get myself into?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=010&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=200054962024&rd=1,1

Shes double fir over oak, hauled and refastened with over 150' of new planking in 2001. Bilges remain dry, but she needs paint. It's 'glassed over the cabin top to prevent leaks, aft decks are painted, bow are still raw wood. He also noted the drive system can "pivot up to 36 inches" for tighter steering.

The bride actually somewhat supports this idea, probably due to the price, so I can't let a decent opportunity for spousal support pass me by.

Im open to any and all opinions, Im very curious what everyone has to say. It will be kept in the salt (probably in Anacortes) and used as a mothership in the Sound/SJ islands/Gulf islands.

Thanks!

E

[Kaa]

She doesn't look to be in good shape. Don't think about painting, think about what wood you'll need to cut out and replace, and by the pictures it looks to be a considerable amount... This boat needs lots of time or money.

Kaa

[Tylerdurden]

It looks like a converted Navy boat. I almost bought one back in 95 in Salem Ma. fo 5 grand. this one has a new engine I would think because they originally had graymarine 671. Look out for the tankage on this beast. that was the deal killer on mine. Old steel tanks are a problem.

[JimD]

Personally, I would never buy any second hand big ticket item I hadn't personally inspected and in the case of a boat professionally surveyed. Maybe it's a great deal, maybe not.

[uncas]

Hard to tell. what condition is the power plant in... ummm... What the heck is an inboard/outboard engine... I've never heard those opposite descriptions used together...
What is she refastened with... As someone else mentioned, has she been surveyed by anyone.. I guess those questions can be asked to the owner...
I'd be careful... If nothing else especially if you want to insure it...

[Tylerdurden]

All good advice, I just went on an e-bay exploration on the Night Scraper. It was not pretty but the ad would lead you to believe it was a silk purse. I figured it would be cheaper to build a new hull rather than try to fill in the rust. Be careful and don't spend a dime without a good looksee. Worth the money to have her hauled if your serious.
Good luck.

[uncas]

The problem I find with ebay and boats is ya don't have time to do what needs to be done for any kind of peace of mind.. Ya got what ten days... Not really enough time to even get a survyor to look at it and certainly not enough time to get a surveyor who REALLY knows wooden boats.. I have run into this problem.. The boat I was looking at was surveyed.. To me.. and a few others, he did a terrible job.. Even missed some obvious visible rot in the boom... I found that within two minutes of looking at it.. Inexcusable...

The only thing I can say is if ya buy it, you are buying it on faith....

psss. I am constantly amazed here on the forum by people saying.. ypu but needs a lot of work.. I can't think of a boat.. even a fiberglass one that doesn't even the general maintanance...adds up... And certainly a wooden boat always does need a lot of continous work...
Not a rant.. just an observation on the comments here and on other threads.. " Looks rough ", "looks like a lot of work".. etc...

[Spokaloo]

Well per the owner (who lives many moons away), she has not been surveyed since his ownership. Does not know what it was refastened with. Im guessing the issue with the drive is not so much an IO, but some version of a shaft that articulates (who really knows). Needs that board above the waterline on the stbd bow, but per him the planking is solid.

I have opened a dialogue with the owner that might last longer than the ad of the boat. If someone in the seattle area wants to have a look at her in the flesh, I can not only arrange it through him, but it would be appreciated by me and make for a rather interesting thread (with pictures) for people who have considered a purchase like this. Let people see the process, give an excuse for a boat nut or two to look at a nice old salmon boat, could be fun!

Motor is not original, says it runs well, lots of new stuff but still in the process of finishing if I had to guess. I think some of the work I can handle with my very limited experience, and what I cant Im sure I can find help with over in the Seattle/Anacortes area.

Now about moorage.....

E

[uncas]

Another issue... moorings vs. slips.. winter rates vs.season
( spring/summer fall ) rates...These differ broadly....
Example.. a yard in MD.. charged 25.00/foot in water for the winter.. It jumped to 100.00/foot in the season... This is for a slip...Moorings.. again varies... I have access to a mooring in CT.. 200.00/year if I am not mistaken.. This includes hauling out the ball every winter...

pss.. remember in your discussions with the owner.. HE wants to sell the boat!!!!!

[willmarsh3]

I don't know for sure but it appears that cabin was added on the back of the bridge. If so I think she would be top heavy and not suitable for rough seas. Definitely a big item to check.

Will.

[Thorne]

Be afraid....very afraid!

Looks like the typical rotting wooden livaboard boat -- don't go there without a really good survey and personal inspection at the very least. The chunk of plywood tacked onto the scuppers tells most of the story, at least for me.

http://i10.ebayimg.com/01/i/000/79/9c/52b8_3.JPG

[Lew Barrett]

How much time and money do you have, and how many three day weekends do you want to spend in Seattle? This boat has sat out at Fisherman's Terminal for who knows how many years with an owner who probably hasn't visited her in ages. Walk away unless you are prepared for the battle of your life.

[uncas]

Two things I have learned with Uncas.. Any wooden boat under say 80,000 needs help..
2) with my talks with Paul Haley about pleasure boats.. none are meant to last....
When I was in NS.. saw a Cris Craft.. not sure the model.. The damn thing was about 40' long... I looked at it.. causally.. The boat was built in 1970 something.. Rot.. visible rot... I felt that either the owner was nuts to put money into it or he didn't have a wood stove.

personally, I could not figure out what was holding the thing together...Should have taken pictures.... Compared to Airlie.. umm, she looked like a new boat ewven with her problems.

[kc8pql]

The "Buy it Now" price tells it all. There is no such thing as a good $7000. 43' boat. If it was worth a damn some local would have snapped it up long before it got to Ebay.

[uncas]

Spokaloo.. Look at Airlie under people and places and compare the two.. Airlie needs work granted but if ya compare the two.. I sense you will walk away...
I realize that I ranted a bit about how much a wooden boat costs to maintain but even with me there are limits... I think you may end up buying a lot of kindling....
And as I have written, the owner wants to sell and will tell you what you want to hear.. Take what he says with a chunk of rock salt. please..

Remember, I have been there.. done that.. I speak and write from shall I say, casual experience...

ps.. we all take chances on a wooden boat as there could be a lot of hidden issues.. The thing to do is TRY to minimize the the list of potentail issues...

[Tritone]

What kind of disaster am I trying to get myself into?

From the pictures, I doubt you will find a marina willing to berth it in Anacortes, let alone get insurance for it! This boat gives new meaning to the old adage "A boat is just a hole in the water surrounded by wood, down which you WILL pour endless amounts of money".

Keep looking, I'm sure you can do very much better......

James

[Peter Malcolm Jardine]

Lots of work... If you're prepared to sink a lot of hours and money in...

On the other hand, the diesel is probably worth nearly the price of the boat if it's okay... which means the boat is worth almost nothing.

[Salted Nuts]

Hi Spokaloo, Just 2yrs ago I too purchased a similar 40' ex trawler to what you are looking at. I have just clocked over $130,000 on mine, with over 4mths out of the water. It has come up a treat, but you need to ask yourself if you can afford this, as they are not an item that you can offload quickly.
The one you are looking at looks very tired, has had little maintenance and has had many bodgey looking modifications that do not follow with the style or lines of that era of boat. I would suspect that is why it is listed for the price it is.
My suggestion would be that if you are serious about that style of vessel, look for a well maintained ex trawler that has just come out of service where you can see what you are buying and not a boat that has been butchered like this one. The cheap buy price will soon be forgotten after your budget is blown.
Good Luck!!!

[SV Papillon]

Alot better boats come through up here. For a little more money you can pick up a converted fishing boat or something like it with charactor that the owner has taken care of. Look in the back of National Fisherman.
Jake

[Tom Hunter]

Spookaloo,

Buy that boat and you are going to learn something, but it's going to be something you don't want to know.

The best thing you can do for your bride is not buy this boat.

Unless you can pre-sell the engine for more than the cost of buying and scrapping the boat, then it might be worth doing.

[Spokaloo]

Compelling testimony. As I already have my hands full with the bateau.com NINA that Im building (plywood due in tomorrow from customs), you have all beaten some sense into me. She and I are wanting to do mothershipping with our kayaks around the sound and gulf islands, so I will just keep my ear to the ground.

On the other hand, CMD does make some rather beautiful 30' trawlers eh? Just need something that can sleep 4 in a pinch, not a big fuel hog (1-2gph), and steady in crappy seas as the chop can get a touch steep, and the straight of georgia can get a little hairy.

E

[Lew Barrett]

If the Straight of Georgia is really blowing, it's best to wait it out in Nanaimo.

[Kitlani]

If you are already working on a boat, then buy a new one and have the best of both worlds.

-rg-

[Kitlani]

I DO vote against the purchase but look at the task a friend of mine has taken on:

http://www.vikingboatlift.com/daneboat/rbp.html

We are talkiin' two lifetimes of work.

-rg-

[seo]

Well, I DO work as a marine surveyor, and I've surveyed a lot of wooden boats, but not in Seattle. She looks very tired, but sometimes looks are deceiving. I've surveyed several commercial boats in Coast Guard inspected service that are over 100 years old, and many really good heavy-built hulls that are 60 years.
As far as hull type, she looks like a nice hull. I doubt the aft cabin will effect her stability much, since her fishing gear has been taken off, and they took more from stability than that house will.

As far as not being able to run aft on the waterways, well, you're looking at a cruising yacht, not a workboat, right?
The engine looks like a 3304 or 3306 Cat, which is still a current engine, and very well liked.
I'll be amazed if the boat sells on Ebay, and once the auction is over you can call the owner and talk to him. At least make sure the engine starts and runs, gears shift, pumps suck, compressors blow, peanut whistle goes toot.
When you go on board to look at it, turn off the bilge pumps. Turn them on again in an hour, and time how long they run.
Look for signs of leaking overheads and decks. Leaky decks are a bigger pain than leaky hulls.
Stick your nose in all the closed spaces, bring a really bright flashlight. Mushrooms? Smell of dank funk?
Haul her out. She's small enough to haul on a travelift and set down for a few days. You'll have to do a lot of scraping or pay for pressure washing to get a look at the hull. I personally would rather see a boat fiberglassed than planked over with a second skin of wood, but let's not start that.
Look for planks that don't lay fair, butts that are sticking out, jerks and hard spots in the aft turn of the bilge and in the tuck aft. She may well have concrete poured in her bilge aft, so you're kind of buying a pig in a poke.
My advice would be to absolutely not buy her for restoration into some princess of the July fourth salmon festival boat parade. But if you have some skill for the work, and the time to use a boat that could travel up the inside passage if managed by a good seaman, and if you have the money it takes to fix up such a boat, then take the time to use it, I guess I'd say that if she doesn't leak and the engine starts right up and runs good, then maybe you can buy her for $1,000, spend $20,000 on her, and go for a great trip, then sell her for $10,000. What's wrong with these numbers?
If you haven't done a lot of wood working, and don't work well with tools, then I'd say don't touch it. Buy a glass boat.

[Spokaloo]

As it is, the owner hasnt contacted me back with some photos that I requested. My opinion lay somewhere with what you said seo about the moderate investment, have my fun, and send her down the road with some repairs and a nice coat of paint. When I do regain contact with the owner I will try to get over to the westside (just a short 250 miles away) and have a look at her, if for nothing else curiosity's sake.

E