Opinions needed please.

[Paul F]

Hi everyone,
I'm considering building another boat for use on the lakes, rivers and protected coastal waters here in North Carolina so I'm looking for any thoughts, opinions or experience with this particular design.

http://www.thomasjhillboatdesigns.com/the_long_point.html

Thank you,

Paul

P.S. I sure do miss Norm Messinger.

[rbgarr]

Nice choice.

The only concern I'd have with a flat bottom boat is pounding in NC coastal waters. But that's not a huge drawback if you are standing at a console and keeping speed reasonable.

[adampet]

I know the waters this boat was designed for and I'm sure it'll take some chop. The thick bottom seems like a good idea.

Adam

[StevenBauer]

We saw one of these at the WoodenBoat Show last summer. Very nice boat. Seems like a good fit with your area.

Steven

[ishmael]

No offense to Tom Hill, but I like David Stimson's version better.

The Westpoint skiff evolved. Alton Wallace, who I had the pleasure of sipping coffee with, was an old timer. He built his skiffs out of the edges from small time sawmills--almost free wood. The shape is old, as old as the outboard that runs them.

I'm prejudiced, so don't take this to the bank, but David Stimson's skiff, same idea, is a much prettier boat.

[Paul F]

No offense to Tom Hill, but I like David Stimson's version better.

The Westpoint skiff evolved. Alton Wallace, who I had the pleasure of sipping coffee with, was an old timer. He built his skiffs out of the edges from small time sawmills--almost free wood. The shape is old, as old as the outboard that runs them.

I'm prejudiced, so don't take this to the bank, but David Stimson's skiff, same idea, is a much prettier boat.



It appears he doesn't offer the plans for the Pine Island on his website. http://www.by-the-sea.com/stimsonmarine/

[ishmael]

Hi Paul,

I took a closer look. Hill has taken the basics of the Westpoint skiff and made them into a flat bottomed boat. It's quite different in design than Stimson's, which retains the round chine of the original. I'm trying to think what David calls his boat. The plans were available from our sponsor, last I looked.

Different building, similar results, though as has been mentioned think about what the flat bottom means in a chop.

The original Westpointer, from which both are derived, is a great boat. Moderate V, with enough flat to hop on a plane with 25 horses on the back. Very able for the type.

Alton Wallace, who was profiled in WB, I dunno, must be fifteen years ago, built them for years in his little shop down the road from where I once lived. Always the same. Pine strips nailed with galvanized finish nails. A lot of small-scale lobstering happened out of Alton's boats.

Good luck.

[StevenBauer]

I'm not sure why you think this skiff is in any way related to the Westpointer or the Ocean Pointer. Sure, they are all skiffs, and the Ocean Pointer is based on the West Pointer, but Hill's flat bottom skiff comes from a completely different lineage.
Wait 'til Phil sees this thread, he was quite taken with the Long Point Skiff at the Show. I took a pic of him at the helm but I think it was with his camera, not mine.

Steven

[Phil Heffernan]

It appears he doesn't offer the plans for the Pine Island on his website. http://www.by-the-sea.com/stimsonmarine/

I found this, the 'Ocean Pointer':

http://www.by-the-sea.com/stimsonmarine/smplans.html

A handsome craft. Both this and the Hill design are well designed, it's a question of flat bottom or not...

PH

[Phil Heffernan]

Steve, you are so right about my instant love affair with Hill's boat...There's something about the simplicity and workboat qualities of these designs that really get me...I'm also a fan of the Handy Billy...

I love the center console skiff concept, very efficient, lots of room and cheap speed...

PH

[ishmael]

Steven,

Just different opines. I realize they are very different, but Hill gives a nod with his naming, "Long point," as to where his thinking originated.

[StevenBauer]

I just don't think the word 'point' makes any connection between these dis-similar boats. Long Point on the Cape has nothing in common with West Point in Phipsburg.

Steven

[ishmael]

It's not worth arguing about. We agree, they are very different boats. Someone should call Tom and hear what he was thinking.

Stimson's is a better boat. Not as quick to build, but better.

[Paul F]

It's not worth arguing about. We agree, they are very different boats. Someone should call Tom and hear what he was thinking.

Stimson's is a better boat. Not as quick to build, but better.


Better?

[Paul F]

Here appears to be a boat of similar design. It's just to large for my particular needs. It has those nice work boat lines which I tend to like.

http://www.shoestringshipyard.com/gallery-humblepeasant22.htm

[ishmael]

I think it's better, Paul. As with all things better, it's more complex to build. Hill's skiff is going to pound in a chop. It's fine in its way, but different.

Funny how it works. My brother had a Boston Whaler Montauk. The worst boat I've ever been in for pounding in a chop, yet well considered. I hated that boat. No one was ever comfortable it in.

Wallace's boats were drop a dime workboats. He built them of offcuts from the local saw mills. A decent way to make a boat that wasn't intended to live past about twenty years. Still a decent, inexpensive way, if you can find the sawmill and the offcuts. Not so many are sawing wood that way.

[StevenBauer]

Ocean Pointer - 19'6" x 6'9" x 1200 pounds

Long Point Skiff - 15'10" x 5'2" x 400 pounds

I still don't see any similarity here.

Steven

[ishmael]

You may be right, Steven. I don't wish to argue it. It would be interesting to have Hill's inpute. I used to have his number.

[Wiley Baggins]

Paul F,

You are correct that plans for the Pine Island Skiff are not available. It's too bad. Although she doesn't meet the design brief being discussed here, she's a great looking, and apparently very useful, boat.

Thanks for the link to the Humble Peasant 22. I had not seen that boat before.

[Jon Agne]

What about a Simmons Sea Skiff?

http://www.simmonsseaskiff.com/

[Paul F]

What about a Simmons Sea Skiff?

http://www.simmonsseaskiff.com/



The Simmons is a great boat and has a wonderful history here in North Carolina. It would be perfectly suited for my needs except for the cost and complexity is a bit to much for me right now. HOWEVER, it is at the top of my list of small power skiffs to build! I would like to try my hand at a somewhat simpler / smaller lapstrake skiff for now. I know very little about lapstrake construction but Thomas Hill's designs appear to be a good place to begin my journey. What do you think?
-Paul