Swing out garage doors

[Clinton B Chase]

Hey all,

Looking for some carriage style, swing out garage doors for my new garage/shop. I want swing out, not overhead. They'd need to be stock designs that can fit standard size openings. My budget is 1 boat unit or less. They should look decent but don't need to be period doors or anything of that nature.

Cheers,
Clint

[rbgarr]

Clint,

Understand not wanting overhead doors. Just remember that when we get snow/ice like we have these past couple of storms that you'll have to keep it cleared away so that the doors can swing open. Would doors that slide open along the outside walls do, or is the building not set up for something like that? See http://www.abettersite.com/a-rockler-barn-hardware.html

[Clinton B Chase]

No room for them to slide open. Someone suggested the roll up doors but they are too "self storage" facility looking. So, it'll be shovel the snow out of the way and swing open.

Thanks.
Clint

[JimConlin]

My shop has a pair of swing-out doors. The good news is that they don't obstruct ceiling light fixtures as an overhead garage door would. The bad news is that if there's snow or ice on the ground outside 'em, i'm gonna spend some time clearing it. A lowered stoop would help here.
Another section of the shop has a conventional roll-up garage door from Home Depot. Aside from the fact that it obscures the ceiling when open, it's more weather tight and a lot easier to work with.
Can't remember what it cost, but i recollect that it was quite reasonable. These things are manufactured in volume.
If I weren't concerned about the outside appearance, i'd prefer the roll-up door.

[Paul Girouard]

There are overhead door that look like carriage doors , they are spendy though.

http://www.hahnswoodworking.com/carriagedoors.html

http://www.hahnswoodworking.com/carriagedoors.html

Or make your own:cool: Hardware could be found or maybe hand forged:cool:

[Rob Stokes, N. Vancouver]

I rolled my own. 2x5 ladder-style frame, Styrofoam insulation with spray foam to fill the voids, 1/4" plywood skin on the interior and exterior glued and stapled and a "faux" front on it for fun. Windows were custom 1/2" airspace - cost $30 each, muntons are fake, hinges are real.

http://www.robswoodworking.com/images/doors.jpg
http://www.robswoodworking.com/images/door_finished.jpg
http://www.robswoodworking.com//images/door_finished_int.jpg

Rob

[rbgarr]

Maybe a step through, inward opening 'people' door would work for winter entry and exit. I once worked in a shop that had that.

[Don Z.]

I'm curious about something similar, except instead of "swing out", I'd like to do a "bi-fold". If I just swing along a track, I'll run out of room, but if I can accordian it (kind of like a closet door), it should work well. Somewhere I have a photo of the type of door I mean...

I think I can manage building the door itself, it's the hardware that is proving difficult. I've been all through McMaster-Carr and Grainger's, but haven't really found the right bearing. Any thoughts?

[Hwyl]

Maybe a step through, inward opening 'people' door would work for winter entry and exit. I once worked in a shop that had that.


That's what I was going to say. Is it going to be a garage in another life? You might want to make something real simple and take into account that you won't be opening it much. Then when you return to your suburban lifestyle, you can have a regular up n over door.

[Paul Girouard]

Clint I got a snail mail catalog today that has some hardware that could work for your doors , heres a link to thier web site , worth a look:


http://www.vandykes.com/subcategory/215/

Sample hinge :

http://www.vandykes.com/images/products/02008266-lg.jpg

Home (http://www.vandykes.com/) > Restoration Hardware (http://www.vandykes.com/category/1/) > Gate Hinges & Gate Latches (http://www.vandykes.com/subcategory/215/) Gate Hinges & Gate Latches (http://www.vandykes.com/subcategory/215/)http://www.vandykes.com/images/icons2/print.gif printer friendly version (http://www.vandykes.com/print/02008266/) Iron Gate Hinge 16 1/2"

http://www.vandykes.com/images/products/02008266-lg.jpg
$37.99$34.19for 6 or more Item no: 02008266

Iron
Overall Width 16 1/2" x Overall Height 7"
Sold Each


Humm that cool it posted the photo just by C&P normally I have to post the photo seperate .

Hope it helps , G/L :)

[StevenBauer]

I'm curious about something similar, except instead of "swing out", I'd like to do a "bi-fold". If I just swing along a track, I'll run out of room, but if I can accordian it (kind of like a closet door), it should work well. Somewhere I have a photo of the type of door I mean...

I think I can manage building the door itself, it's the hardware that is proving difficult. I've been all through McMaster-Carr and Grainger's, but haven't really found the right bearing. Any thoughts?

Don, I built a pair of 19' wide insulated bifold doors on the end of a post and beam barn once. The owner didn't want any center post. I used barn door track hardware. It took some fooling with. What I ended up doing was mounting the track at a slight angle. In the center the track was flush with the wall but at the corners the track had to be spaced away from the building a couple of inches. I also used some huge strap hinges for the corner pivot. It all came out so tight that the customer had to crack a window to get the woodstove going. :D

Steven

[coelacanth2]

How wide will the doors be? Really wide doors have a nasty tendancy to sag, and place a huge cantilevered load on the hinges. One of the best solutions to that dilemma that I have seen is to fit a couple of wheels on the ends of the doors to support them, angled to follow the arc of opening and closure. On one rawther fawncy carriage house, they were iron wheels running on iron tracks set in granite block...:D

[Clinton B Chase]

Still not sure what to do but am now leaning back in the overhead door option and setting up track lights on the sides so when the door is open lights can shine on the boat on a nice summer night...maybe I can set up a fluorescent light hooked to the inside of the open door to provide light on the forward section of the boat under the door. In the winter, I'll want a tight door. I have a friend who works for Clopay so I may be able to get a decent price from him. Anybody have Clopay's door anecdotes? The bifolds sound cool, Steven, but tedious. Any experiences of excellent shop lighting in regards to best fixture types or ideas on the trick of lighting aound an open garage door? Send em my way. TX.

Cheers,
Clint

[rbgarr]

I had a double Clopay door (uninsulated) in Georgia and it was okay but leaked water underneath. You might want to have a lip on the floor inside to help prevent that.

I thought the reason you wanted to avoid having an overhead door was so you could brace molds, etc. to overhead rafters/joists the full length of the building.

Good luck. Monday is start day, huh!

[hikingchrs]

In my garage I set up a 4' "shop light" directly over the glass windows when door is rolled up...
Chris

[ssor]

It sounds like what you are seeking is a set of barn doors. Look for barn door hinges and support the latch edge of the doors with a diagonal stay anchored about four feet above the top hinges. I have seen sixteen foot wooden gates supported in this manner and they naver sag.

[mcdenny]

Doors open at night with lights on = bugs here in Michigan. How 'bout Maine?

[katiedobe]

Rob,

Nice looking doors. I had a set of doors built for a rental house garage about 15years ago, same technique. They are still great and have not sagged on bit.
Looks like a nice shop space.

[rbgarr]

Someone suggested the roll up doors but they are too "self storage" facility looking.

FWIW, you can get them with heavy fabric and flexible windows instead of that corrugated aluminum stuff. Raynor is one mfr.

[Paul Girouard]

Rob,

Nice looking doors. I had a set of doors built for a rental house garage about 15years ago, same technique. They are still great and have not sagged on bit.
Looks like a nice shop space.

What in the hell are you talking about Katie?? I don't see any photo's :confused: ssor's post??

He should make some nice doors , swing out doors are way nicer looking , don't take up wall space , in fact I have shelfs on my swing out doors :) , and don't take up ceiling space / kill lighting etc . If it's a shop a 3'0" man door will get you in and out , and when you need to open the big doors you just do it.

Now for a garage where the little women parks her car a overhead door with elec. door opener makes more sense. But what sudo boat builder / woodworker parks a car in a garage anyway:D

[J P]

How about a horizontal bifold hanger type door?

http://www.bifold.com/photo_designer.php

[Rob Stokes, N. Vancouver]

Rob,

Nice looking doors. I had a set of doors built for a rental house garage about 15years ago, same technique. They are still great and have not sagged on bit.
Looks like a nice shop space.

"WAS" a nice shop space. It was at our place in Bonney Lake WA, but we've since sold and moved. I sure do miss that shop though.

Rob

[Bill R]

My shop in Pittsburgh had swing out doors. I made my own to replace the ancient, sagging things that were there when we bought the property.

FWIW, i would much rather have swing out doors than OH. The OH blocks too much light, and uses valuable overhead space IMHO.

[Bruce Hooke]

Doors open at night with lights on = bugs here in Michigan. How 'bout Maine?

RATHER. At my parents' home in Maine we made a screen of mosquito netting that can be hung across the whole opening to allow for leaving the garage/workshop door open. Even during the day the bugs can get pretty nasty in early summer...

[katiedobe]

First of all Paul,

Katiedobe is the white doberman sitting in my lap. I use her name on line and as my email address.
My name is Jimmy, just like I sign all my posts. Nice to meet you.:D

Now the pictures of Rob's very nicely done doors load quickly if you click on the links, three of them, that he included in his first post on this thread.

Thirdly, I like the look of the outward opening Bi-folds. As seen on this link. http://www.bifold.com/index.php Kinda cool.

Makes me want to make some for a set of windows that look out on the lake just for the challenge of it.
Peace.


http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid207/p676a611da7155b5b4d6580a6d7f37c25/eeabafe5.jpg

[Don Z.]

Don, I built a pair of 19' wide insulated bifold doors on the end of a post and beam barn once. The owner didn't want any center post. I used barn door track hardware. It took some fooling with. What I ended up doing was mounting the track at a slight angle. In the center the track was flush with the wall but at the corners the track had to be spaced away from the building a couple of inches. I also used some huge strap hinges for the corner pivot. It all came out so tight that the customer had to crack a window to get the woodstove going. :D

Steven

Not sure I follow.

While I understand the track door part, but I can't quite picture what you are saying. In my mind, I see a wheel on the track, with an axle of some sort hanging vertically down. That axle would attach to the door itself, but how? It needs to support the weight of the door, but at the same time the door needs to rotate around the axle, and that's where I'm stumped.

I like the idea of the vertically folding doors. I priced them, and they want a god-awful amount of money for them. I wonder if I could make those, myself? The manufactured ones are a wood veneer on a metal frame. I was thinking of going solid wood (cedar), because I don't know anything about welding... but I guess I could learn to weld... much prefer working in wood though.

[Paul Girouard]

First of all Paul,

Katiedobe is the white doberman sitting in my lap. I use her name on line and as my email address.
My name is Jimmy, just like I sign all my posts. Nice to meet you.:D

Now the pictures of Rob's very nicely done doors load quickly if you click on the links, three of them, that he included in his first post on this thread.

Thirdly, I like the look of the outward opening Bi-folds. As seen on this link. http://www.bifold.com/index.php Kinda cool.

Makes me want to make some for a set of windows that look out on the lake just for the challenge of it.
Peace.


http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid207/p676a611da7155b5b4d6580a6d7f37c25/eeabafe5.jpg


Eh sorry about that eh Jimmy ;) Hard enought to figger out who to call what around this place all these made up names , folks using three or four etc :rolleyes: Sure you sign um all but when I guys scrollin back and forth well eh it happens . I did later see the three links to Rob's shop garage etc , but didn't post back that I'm a idoit .

So Peace back at ya , what's the dogs name Katie ?? Or do ya throw the dobe into that as well??? She MTL one confused puppy if in ya do.

So again Peace out bro like Chad used to say:D

[Paul Girouard]

Not sure I follow.

While I understand the track door part, but I can't quite picture what you are saying. In my mind, I see a wheel on the track, with an axle of some sort hanging vertically down. That axle would attach to the door itself, but how? It needs to support the weight of the door, but at the same time the door needs to rotate around the axle, and that's where I'm stumped.

I like the idea of the vertically folding doors. I priced them, and they want a god-awful amount of money for them. I wonder if I could make those, myself? The manufactured ones are a wood veneer on a metal frame. I was thinking of going solid wood (cedar), because I don't know anything about welding... but I guess I could learn to weld... much prefer working in wood though.

The wheel at the end of the door would be attached thru a bracket that holds it but it would pivot on the door the wheels them self would follow the track . Thats how standard barn door hardware would work in that set up.

I think why Steve had to pad the tracks out at the winge point is due the hinge pivoting that edge of the door outward as the door swung open the wheels would bind if the track didn't move out as the wheel although able to rotate would need to stay in line with that pivoting hinged door point.

There more than likely some wierd hinge setup made that would allow that hinge point to not rotate outward , it would have to be a double hinged point hinge or a strange bent type hinge .

Euro cabinet hinges have that type capablity but would not have the weight carrying capabilties to handle a big heavy door .

Very inventive Steve ;)

[StevenBauer]

Paul has it. Somewhere I have pictures but that was before the digital age. The doors were really heavy: roughsawn 2x4 hemlock frame with 2" of foam insulation inset with t&g pine on the inside and roughsawn 1x12 board and batten on the outside. Each panel was 4 1/2 by 8 feet - it took two people to lift them.

Steven

[Don Z.]

The "bracket at the end of the door" is the part I'm trying to figure out how to make. It needs tb be heavy enough to support the door (and I'm thinking a door about 3 feet wide by 12 tall) while also being able to rotate.

What I did see (and I'm looking for the photos) at the garage at the Winchester House in San Jose was what looked to be a simple solution (If I'm understanding the "swing out" correctly) to the hinge problem. The first panel of the doors was only half as wide as the others, so the "hinge point" was centered on the door panels. One "hook on the rail" supported each door.

[Paul Girouard]

The "bracket at the end of the door" is the part I'm trying to figure out how to make. It needs tb be heavy enough to support the door (and I'm thinking a door about 3 feet wide by 12 tall) while also being able to rotate.

What I did see (and I'm looking for the photos) at the garage at the Winchester House in San Jose was what looked to be a simple solution (If I'm understanding the "swing out" correctly) to the hinge problem. The first panel of the doors was only half as wide as the others, so the "hinge point" was centered on the door panels. One "hook on the rail" supported each door.

http://www.hardwarestore.com/media/product/620495_front500.jpg


Here ya go Don , there may be a shoulder on the top of that bolt that would need to be rounded over so the bolt could rotate while the wheels followed the track . I don;t think there is I think it will just rotate as normal operation.

Hinge the jamb edge with the hinge knuckle to the exterior of the building and the center / pivot point of the bifold the knuckle would be inside the building.

[Paul Girouard]

Here's the link to more options Don,

http://hardware.hardwarestore.com/73-barn-door-hardware.aspx

[Don Z.]

Thanks! That might work, if I can get it to rotate. If not, perhaps I can find a way to make this one do it...

http://images.orgill.com/200x200/8685596.jpg

[Clinton B Chase]

Amazing how a simple question about swing out garage doors yields all these thoughts, including a picture of a guy with a white doberman :)

We'll build some nice 8' tall cedar doors for the shop...
having trouble getting pics up

Cheers,
Clint

[Tylerdurden]

The hinges are the bitch here, I built a set of doors for my last shop.
The hinges were big bucks and I wasn't worried about looks. ended up using surplus pillow block bearings with half inch shafting for hinges.
Total cost under a hundred bucks. For two heavy doors on a 14' opening it is the cats ass. I drove by the place last year and after 15 years in the air they are still going strong.
There was some metal fab involved, the shafts were pinned through a bracket I welded onto 4" channel which bolted to the frame and the four pillow blocks were bolted to the door. It would swing all the way out to flat against the building that way and the doors didn't need rollers like I see on lots of swing doors. Was a bit tricky lifting them and dropping them onto the pins. Took a bit of time and some serious cussing.

[emichaels]

Hey all,

Looking for some carriage style, swing out garage doors for my new garage/shop. I want swing out, not overhead. They'd need to be stock designs that can fit standard size openings. My budget is 1 boat unit or less. They should look decent but don't need to be period doors or anything of that nature.

Cheers,
Clint

Clint I don't know how much overhead room you and Steven have designed/built there, but what I am going to do on our little barn here for the one side that is used everyday is to make a carriage house style "panel" similar to one describe in earlier post on this thread and instead of swinging it out as two doors it will pivot up and in. Our barn has 10' head room and the door is 8' high so I have a lot of room to pivot and tuck the door all the way in. I am using simple overhead garage door track and hardware. LIke Steven did on the barn bifolds for a client I will have to get a little creative with the hardware mounting and track placement. But its just a geometery thing. Should be easy enough for the wife to flip it up with one arm and should look just like a carriage door with no seams.

Eric

[StevenBauer]

Not quite finished yet, but here are the doors we built for Clint's shop:

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r241/bauerdad/Ostkust/IMG_0628.jpg

They are insulated, 5" thick. Kinda heavy.

Steven

[Paul Girouard]

You have a dissimilar house wrap issue going on there, big trouble down the road :eek: :D The left door need to go up a RCH or the right one down , one or the other:confused: but you know that:rolleyes:

5" thick:eek: :eek: what ya got ridged foam sandwiched in there:confused: Clint needs to make a dump run as well:eek:

Nice job Steve:cool: M&T joints?

Is that Killroy we see in the windows ?

[djswan]

The Wooden Boat Forum Gods have blessed me again.

I get to build some garage doors and a boat house door, starting today with a design. There is a real chance I might go and salvalge some old ones and avoid the headache of having to think.

I saw lots of good idea's and a white doberman.

What direction do I bow to thank the WBF?

Derek

[Paul Girouard]

Derek theres some great "gate ideas" in FHB "Houses" issue , the latest one , might be worth a gander;)

I think you bow to the east , New England for WBF:D


BTW answer yer PM's:rolleyes: :D

[ahp]

We had them on the house my dad built in 1936. He made them up out of 1 1/2 lumber, and they never sagged. The trick is to have good diagonal bracing, sturdy hinges and frame. Yes they are a pest when it snows. I should know, I shovelled them out many times, but you can live with that.

[djswan]

No swing out barn doors in on eve ends in Montana

I have a new design standard.

I'll sneak a peak at the FHB at the store.
I thought it was Boulder, CO:confused: It is facing south from me and I could catch a tan and point the garage doors that way to let the sun do the hard work in winter.

[Eric D]

In laws have HUGE swinging doors. Big enough to pull a end loader or a quad axle dump truck into the shop. Never sag, no worries from the construction point of view. Issue is the snow as mentioned, but also the SPRING of the year, right in front of the shop is gravel and the spring of the year means frost heaves in the yard which will pinch the bottom of the door. My suggestion was to put a concrete pad out in front of your doors which it looks like Steve will be covering....

Nice doors by the way!!

[Clinton B Chase]

I am happy with the doors! The match the fir front door and overhang also in beautiful DF. The weatherstripping is going up. Electrical/framing inspection tomorrow. Insulation this weekend and next. Sheetrock and pine boards after that. Hope to be building Gartside's "Bob" in this shop by the end of the summer. Stay tuned. Steven do you have more photos of the shop we can put up?

Cheers,
Clint

[Paul Girouard]

Insulation this weekend and next.

Hire it done , at least here in Washington companys that do only insulation do a good job and if / when I price out just the material/ insulation the dollars are just about the same , they must buy in huge quanity or the lumber yards and home centers really jack up the price.

Out here they put the foam "rope " around the windows and doors , foam wire / plumbing , etc holes and caulk the exterior wall plates and corners.

Might be well worth your time to get a bid , and it would save you time to boot.

[Clinton B Chase]

Paul, are you talking insulation "batts" or blown in? It's a good suggestion either way.

Clint

[Paul Girouard]

Paul, are you talking insulation "batts" or blown in? It's a good suggestion either way.

Clint


Most companys do both, a few are doing just BIB ( Blown In Batts), or the spray foam ICF maybe (Iso carbo flori) or something like that .

But ya I'm just talking "normal " insulation batts for walls and generally blown in for lids .

[katiedobe]

Nice doors Clinton!
Hire the insulation job done. I did my first house by myself and a friend. By the time we bought all the material, moved it to the attic area and then covered our bodies and lungs and installed it. I was done@! Never Again!!
Next house I did I called three installers and got bids, chose a nice company. Best thing was all I had to do was write a check and the price was much better than I first thought. Must be the volume discount on the material.
Or the cheap Mexican laborers, but they were nice we talked in Spanish and they invited me to eat their lunch with them. Great food!!