Dead balls, heavy duty straightedge

[Clinton B Chase]

Looking for a straightedge at least 3' long that is heavy duty metal or composite with a bevel edge and straight as an arrow for lofting and other things where accuracy is key. I have basically just described a Starrett straightedge, but the 6' one is over $400. Any suggestions for finding something more affordable. (the 3' Starrett is much lass at ~150). THANX!

Cheers,
Clint

[Hwyl]

Could you use a builders level? I have one you can borrow, must be about as long as you're tall.

[Clinton B Chase]

You know I have tried using levels but find it difficult to get a good edge for the pencil to go along...this is for the lofting application. Your level is 6'6"!? Does it play basketball?

Clint

[StevenBauer]

Lee Valley has steel and aluminum straightedges. 12" to 36" in steel, 24" to 50" in aluminum. Prices not too bad, the longest of each is about $60

http://www.leevalley.com/images/item/Woodworking/MarkMeasure/05n6200s8.jpg


http://www.leevalley.com/images/item/woodworking/markmeasure/05n6301s3.jpg

[Paul Pless]

Don't get me wrong, I'm a sucker for buying quality tools myself and often go overkill with regards to my tool budget, but just exactly how dead nuts accurate does it have to be:confused:

I can think of lots of things that should be accurate enough for lofting without going to the expense of Starrett precision tools. If you really want a straight edge, Johnson makes them in 2 foot increments from 4 to 12 feet. Otherwise what about the factory edge of a sheet of 4 x 8 lexan or plexiglass or even the factory edge of a piece of plywood for that matter...

here's the johnson 96", i think their about $30.00.

http://ec1.images-amazon.com/images/P/B0009WG5I0.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_V24275666_SS500_.jpg

[GregH]

I agree with Paul. While I will admit to not having seen every set of offsets ever published, those I have seen only work a resolution 1/16" or even 1/8". Anyway, I have also seen it posted on this forum several times that "wooden boat building is more art than science".

[Paul Scheuer]

How 'bout the horizontal rule from an old-time drafting machine, the one the preceded the chicken wing type, that ran on cords at the edges of the drawiing board. There's probably plenty of obsolete drawing equipment floating around as we go digital.

[Clinton B Chase]

Those steel ones from Veritas will be fine. (only go up to 2' in catalog but glad to see them at 3') We used a 6' Starrett at Landing school...dead nuts is good when you are setting up a grid for lofting! We got our grid to within 1mm accuracy. The offsets can be off clearly, but they'll really be off if the grid is off...my budget is eased up!

Clint

[Don Kurylko]

72” stainless steel straight edge for $69!
http://www.draftingsteals.com/20424.html (http://www.draftingsteals.com/20424.html)

[Dave Fleming]

Got say it but, I bit the bullet bit by bit, buying Starrett strights edges when working in the Loft.

Gosh, SWIMPAL nearly had a stroke at the cost and that was in 1970's dollars.

Don't regret it one damn bit.

I do have an 8 foot Aluminum straight edge from a long defunct outfit back in New York State. It is as best as I can judge almost as accurate as the Starrett. But, it is almost 3 times as wide so I drilled it in four locations and mounted threaded star type handles.
That really helped when crawling around on the loft floor.

I reckon up to that 3 foot size as mentioned in previous post, you can't go wrong.
Over that well......you see what I have to say about that.


Good Luck and Start Collecting Those Alumunum Cans!:D

[epoxyboy]

I use a length of aluminium extrusion that is actually designed to screw onto a wall then slot a shelf into. It has a kind of triangular cross section, with webs for the shelf to go into. Light, strong, cheap and in 3' lengths, pretty damn straight. Even an L section extrusion makes a good straight edge.

Pete

[Dave Fleming]

Problem with Aluminum is.....it can and will distort with temperature and sun light exposure.

That is why those fancy shamncy eurpoean sliding table saws go to such efforts to assure the straighness of their sliding table extrusions.

In large forms say, a 105 foot Aluminum boat hull, I have witnessed the hull distort as much as 1 and 3/4's of an inch when the sun heats one side of it.

Unless you can keep the aluminum straight edge out of the sun you might just be building in a big load of hurt down the road.

[Canoeyawl]

I wouldn't know what to do without my L.S. Starrett straight edge. Even it is kinda fussy though, laying flat on a table it is fine but it has those little arrows that say "support here" - and if you don't, it is not straight...

[mmd]

48" steel rule by McMaster-Carr.

[Hwyl]

Your level is 6'6"!? Does it play basketball?

Clint

Not as a rule.

[Mrleft8]

Bar stock. You can buy it from Starret for about 1/4 of the price of a straight edge. It's thicker (mine's 5/32"), heavier, and cheaper. Only things it doesn't have is "L.S. Starret. Athol, Mass." etched into it, and a hole. Accurate to something like .0001".

[P.I. Stazzer-Newt]

Bar stock. You can buy it from Starret for about 1/4 of the price of a straight edge. It's thicker (mine's 5/32"), heavier, and cheaper. Only things it doesn't have is "L.S. Starret. Athol, Mass." etched into it, and a hole. Accurate to something like .0001".

Mine have "Starrett" but not Athol - got a 66 foot tape which says Athol.

[George Roberts]

Straight edges and other tools come in a number of accuracies. It seems foolish to get one where the accuracy is more than the job needs.

Pencil led is about .5mm, .04". I think. Certainly .04"/3' is sufficient for a straight edge.

[Figment]

Straight edges and other tools come in a number of accuracies. It seems foolish to get one where the accuracy is more than the job needs.

Pencil led is about .5mm, .04". I think. Certainly .04"/3' is sufficient for a straight edge.

A good point. Unless you're drawing lines with a razorblade, I think you're well past the threshold of diminishing returns.

and IMHO, .5 lead would be too frustrating for lofting. That stuff is fragile enough on paper. Drawing on wood, I'd go .7 4H or so.

[Eric D]

spend as much money as the wallet and wife will allow....hell, keeps the market going!!

For me, I went down to my bro in laws shop, had him grab a nice long chunk of 3/8" alum alloy something or other that they use in precision paper machines (don't tell him about warping in heat, those machines get damn hot)

Anyhow, set it on the waterjet. That edge is knife sharp and accurate to .0001 on the 90 and .001 on teh overall lenght.

Had to move some firewood as part of the deal...

Basically go to any tool shop with a waterjet and have them cut you one. Use steel/stainless if Alum scares you, then again, your dime but if is good enough for all the jobs they do, good enough for me.

[ssor]

A new drywall tee square won't show any daylight between the edges of two held together to check for straight. You may turn them any way you want and in four feet they are straight for almost all purposes.

[Tom Robb]

Somebody died and left the school a dufflebag full of thousand dollar bills that burning a hole in yer pocket?
It's a boat, not a new mirror for the Hubble telescope.

[epoxyboy]

Problem with Aluminum is.....it can and will distort with temperature and sun light exposure.


So will anything else, but not any amount that I have noticed marking out with a pencil over a 3' length! I stood on the damn thing once and was all set to bin it (it was free in the first place), except I drew a line one way, turned it round the other way and the edge was dead parallel with the line. Go figure. About $20 from the local hardware store.

Pete

[paladin]

we're worried about a 64th of an inch out of straight and the damn paper crawls more than that........:rolleyes:

[Wild Dingo]

Somebody died and left the school a dufflebag full of thousand dollar bills that burning a hole in yer pocket?
It's a boat, not a new mirror for the Hubble telescope.

:D :D You just gotta love some of he expressions that people write here eh?!! :D

[emichaels]

Clint how about a Home depot drywall straight edge. I have an old one that is getting a little worn from the knife edge against the aluminum. The new one is dead straight, just drill out the perpindicular brace and you have a nice aluminum 48" straight edge for 12 bucks. I know if I spent a bunch of money on a Starret I would step on it and bend it for sure. Anything longer than that wouldn't you just use a string and mark below the string ?

Eric


Opps I just went back and saw ssor' post . I second what he said.

[Clinton B Chase]

http://www.garrettwade.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=107414&itemType=PRODUCT&iMainCat=12395&iSubCat=12407&iProductID=107414

Here is a straightedge ruler I found at Garrett Wade...almost pulled out my wallet on the last part of the description when I read that the graduations are decimal not fractional!!! Almost perfect for what I wanted so I may still get it anyway in 36" and without breaking the bank. For laying out offsets I'll most likely just convert the eighths to tenths. For others looking for something like this, I used a heavy duty bevel edge straightedge (~4') and beam compasses for lofting a large boat and it was a great tool to work with. We were able to produce a loft grid within 1mm accuracy.

Thanks for your other responses...I'll probably pick up the Johnson aluminum straghtedge rule if this one doesn't work out.

Cheers,
Clint

[pcford]

Go to a machinist or sheet metal shop and have them cut a few out of an appropriate gauge on their shear. Should cost a few dollars.

[Nicholas Scheuer]

but lacking scribed dimensions and beveled edge. I've been using a 24" example for decades. It's good for tearing paper, too.

Moby Nick

[Varna]

Clint- I think the accuracy of the machinist's layout tools is unneccesary if you want to keep it simple in the beginning of your building experience. Personally I just use a 48" alum drywall edge, nylon mason's twine, and a alum framing square. I have many starrett layout tools and a much cherished ball head scraper and they have *Aura* for sure and integrity+ -nothing better than having the best tools at hand, but I think it becomes unneccesary if you want to be thrifty in most aspects of boat making- for me just getting the building jig set up within a 1/16" all-around is an achievement. Heck if you have a long bed jointer in tune nice VG fir or such straight eges will serve and when an edge goes just pass over the jointer again.
Have fun- sounds like you have a great set-up in the making for building:-) Best Wishes, and thanks for the plan some months back...
John

[SV Papillon]

If thats all you want. Try going to a fabrication or sheet metal place and have them lop off a 1" or so by what ever long piece of 16 gauge or 14 gauge in a shear. It will be plenty straight and sharp, probably need to be dulled a little. Most likely they will have a piece that will work in the shear left-over pile probably free.

Jake

[Clinton B Chase]

I bought a straightedge from Garrett Wade that was reasonably priced and pretty darn accurate but without the accuracy and expense of a Starrett. I got the straightedge and sighted down it and it looks like a noce fair curve! I did the test on my drafting table and it was 3/16" + off. Pretty embarrassing for them! Otherwise it was very nice...heavy, nice beveled edge, and with clear graduations.

New one is coming. We shall see.

Clint

[Clinton B Chase]

The new one is just as bad! I told Garrett Wade to get the thing the heck out of their catalog!

Oh well. Who needs a straightedge anyway.

Clint

[Nicholas Carey]

I bought a straightedge from Garrett Wade that was reasonably priced and pretty darn accurate but without the accuracy and expense of a Starrett. I got the straightedge and sighted down it and it looks like a noce fair curve! I did the test on my drafting table and it was 3/16" + off. Pretty embarrassing for them! Otherwise it was very nice...heavy, nice beveled edge, and with clear graduations.

New one is coming. We shall see.

ClintJust as an observation, a straightedge doesn't have gradations: its only purpose is to provide a reference straight edge/line. If the thing has graduations, it's a ruler and a different beastie.

[Clinton B Chase]

No, this is supposed to be a straightedge and a ruler...this one is far from straight however. The Starrett straightedges come with or without graduations and are many hundreds of dollars in cost. I plan on calling Paul Gartside and seeing what he uses...

Cheers,
Clint

[Bob Smalser]

It's a stage.

Fussing about arbor runout. Machinist straightedges and squares. Other needlessly expensive tools. Titanium tolerances done in oak and gone with the humidity. That futile effort to emphasize machine because you don't yet trust your eyes and hands.

Besides, drop those machinist tools just once on a concrete floor or kick them off a scaffold, and they generally aren't machinist tools any more.

Buy a 48" yardstick from Home Depot, keep working, save your money for something more important, and you'll get past it soon enough. ;)

[Jim Ledger]

Beware the Dark Side, Luke.:eek:
http://pic50.picturetrail.com/VOL441/8755859/16199889/251207791.jpg

:p