UPS ripoffs/Lee Valley

[paladin]

Ordered some stuff from Lee Valley and it arrived today.....along with a ransom note from UPS. The material that I ordered was paid for by debit card and I gave Lee Valley my UPS number to use for shipping....Lee Valley has a veru low shipping charge that includes the customs clearance fees. They ship to somewhere in NY and their own customs brokers import the goods into the U.S., and I understand it has been done this way since about 1980.
Ups wanted a certified check for the shipping and fees. I wasn't home when the package came so a note was left. When I called to inquire about the "C.O.D." I was advised that the shipper required C.O.D. payment. I called Lee Valley and they denied this, saying it had been billed to my debit card. I then called UPS who changed the story and said it was shipping fees. I reminded them that I had an account and the items were billed to the account...after a couple/three other people got involved I was advised that it was really a brokerage fee....so back to Lee Valley...."No!...We have our own agent clear stuff in the U.S. and turn it over to UPS in the United States...."
Back to UPS...confront them with this....the price changes, it goes up...I call their international folks and drop this in their laps...they apologize and agree to return the goods to Lee Valley, Lee Valley is going to reship, less than 20 bucks in charges as apposed to over $100 from UPS and they are seriously looking into this "abuse".....glad I got it all on tape.......

[Hughman]

Thanks for the heads up, I'm about to order a bunch of stuff from Lee Valley.

[paladin]

Let Lee Valley handle all the shipping...nice feller there keeps his eye's on things...and is watching....

[Stephen]

I ordered a router bit online from Lee Valley.
For some reason, they ship all there orders out of Toronto - even though there are stores in Calgary and Vancouver.
So I paid for shipping all the way across the country, and they packaged the one little bit in a 12"x36" cardboard sleeve. Ridiculous.

[paladin]

Lee Valley has a reason for packaging things that way...they get a reduced rate, and it's not going to get lost as easily....they have had the shipping arrangements with these companies for a couple of decades, and they are sensitive when folks start making changes.

edit and update.....UPS sent the truck back after we had our conversation, and was told to obtain the brokerage fee whether I accepted the package or not....I again refused the package....The UPS supervisor just told me that even if the package was cleared and shipped into the U.S. by anyone, and you use your own shipping number, UPS will charge you about triple for the same service and also a flat customs brokerage fee of approximately 53 dollars U.S......Let Lee valley ship it and pay their shipping, less hassle and a helluva lot cheaper.

[Flying Orca]

Rule #1 for shipping ANYTHING via UPS: instruct the shipper to send the package marked "CLEARS OWN". You might wait an extra day, and you have to clear it through customs yourself (so if you're really rural, you might not want to do this), but you'll save a LOT of money.

I've had the unprintables try to charge me $75 to clear a $50 bike part through customs. Cost me $8 and half an hour of running around... and ever since then it's "clears own" or no deal.

[Paul Pless]

UPS sent the truck back after we had our conversation, and was told to obtain the brokerage fee whether I accepted the package or notThat is riotously funny.

Odd, I usually have really good luck dealing with UPS.

[donald branscom]

Is this when ordering parts from the UK ???

[donald branscom]

I ordered a router bit online from Lee Valley.
For some reason, they ship all there orders out of Toronto - even though there are stores in Calgary and Vancouver.
So I paid for shipping all the way across the country, and they packaged the one little bit in a 12"x36" cardboard sleeve. Ridiculous.

That is so it does not get lost and it will go thru their machinery.

[Peter Malcolm Jardine]

The reverse is true when I buy from the US and get it shipped UPS. They level a brokerage fee that doesn't really exist in fact... the computer probably just tacks it on automatically. I buy vintage parts off Ebay, and ask the seller to use good old USPS. It takes a little longer, but its a lot cheaper. I bought two carburetor rebuild kits from a guy in Missouri, and he only shipped UPS. The shipping ended up being as much as one carb kit... about 60 bucks. :(

[Doug Wood]

I love Lee Valley.

I hate UPS.

[Flying Orca]

The shipping ended up being as much as one carb kit... about 60 bucks. :(

PMJ, try the "clears own" thing next time... seriously. It's not the shipping rates that are killing you, it's the brokerage fees, and the cash dispensing fees, and the going-to-customs fees, and the fee-to-increase-your-fee fees, etc.!

[Terrence Gilhuly]

This is classic UPS profiteering. What can "brown" do to you today.
Any time I have something shipped from the US of A I always try to have it shipped by US Postal Service. Because it is inconvenient some shippers prefer not to. I have in fact chosen not to buy from some companies who will not use the postal service. Of course if it is unique or hard to find product I cave in and give my UPS account number to the shipper.
There is only a small handling fee ($5.00) from Canada Post when they collect the taxes.
Canada Post is a really excellent service and very affordable compared to the courier services.

[Bob Cleek]

Yea, but with their exorbitant shipping charges comes extra service!


http://www.rochardsbunnyranch.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/sexy_ups_girl.jpg

Funny, though... I ordered a trim ring off the net from England for a Lucas turn signal a while back. It was a little thing. I got it in the US mail only about three or four days later... in the mail box. No hassle at all. Go figure.

[George Roberts]

UPS publishes its fees. There should be no surpises.

[Gary E]

How about a detailed explaination of this "clears own" thing?
What does it mean?...how is it done?... why ??...
DETAILS count...

[jverl]

I fully agree! UPS has been the bane of my US purchases. I always try to convince the shipper to use USPS. I recently got a small order from Hamilton Marine with a $75 "brokerage" fee. :mad: Orders that come from overseas are usually shipped by Priority Post which I get at NO charge! :confused: So much for the NAFTA agreements - I guess the shippers are still trying to profit or haven't heard.. :rolleyes:

[Rob Stokes, N. Vancouver]

UPS is notorious for this. I've refused several packages that have inadvertently been shipped UPS form stateside and will continue to do so. In fact I simply refuse to use UPS now - full stop.

Fedex has a neat twist on the whole scam though. They'll drop off the parcel to your door and you get the brokerage charge in the mail a week later. Since you've accepted the package, you're hooped.

For x-border shipping, nothing beats the post office.

Rob

[Flying Orca]

How about a detailed explaination of this "clears own" thing?
What does it mean?...how is it done?... why ??...
DETAILS count...

OK, here's the deal. When UPS brings in a parcel from outside Canada (in my case, either on a plane direct to the airport or on a truck from Minneapolis), the parcel has to be cleared through Canada Customs & Revenue, and UPS cannot release it until it has been cleared.

UPS likes to clear it for you, because they can charge you big $$ for doing so. And seriously, their fees are kind of ridiculous when you look at the details. I've been asked to pay over $75 to clear a $50 bike part, as I think I mentioned earlier. (I refused to pay, which is how I learned about UPS' brokerage scam and how to get around it.)

If you instruct the shipper (very clearly) to instruct UPS (very clearly) that you will clear it yourself, the sequence goes like this:

1) Track the package. When it arrives in your city, you should get a call from UPS within 24 hours.

2) Pick up the customs paperwork from UPS.

3) Take the customs paperwork to customs (usually right by the airport, hence close to the UPS office as well) and pay whatever you have to pay (import duties, sometimes, and for Canadians, GST). In my example of the bike part, the total cost was about $7.

4) Take the completed paperwork back to UPS and collect your parcel. And save a LOT of money.

On a related note, people must be catching on to this. When I first went to the UPS office for the bike part, the "clears own" thing seemed to be a big secret and unusual for people to do. Now they have a special "clears own" office for handling the paperwork, and it's mighty busy.

I presume it works the same way in the USA, but I'd call them to confirm that - and maybe find out whether the UPS paperwork office and the customs office are close enough to each other and to you to make it all worthwhile.

Cheers!

[Gary E]

Thanks for the detailed explanation...

[paladin]

This is the very reason that when I travelled I always tried to pick up "spares" in the country that I was travelling to....the case in point was the Baby Blake head...coming out of Greece I ordered it delivered to the airport, a young fellow delivered the box to me through the agent, I "hand carried" it aboard and cleared customs in the U.S. with a $23 dollar charge for the extra baggage and a $26 customs fee......but the cost was waaaaaay lower that way.....trip to Scotland on an electronics design job netted the CQR anchor, Italy, the self tailing winches (Barbarossa, now Harken) at 25% of the U.S. price......my only problem was in NY, they somehow objected to the nice 426 series Beretta side by side shotgun that I was carrying......the damn shotgun was less than 1/2 price in Germany than at the local duty free shops in Italy...the barrels alone were over 2K.....

[Gary E]

Ok... so when you buy something from another country, and have it shipped to you, how do you know how much this extra charge is going to be?...

[paladin]

In my case I didn't...the parcel was relatively small, a very few pounds and had I let Lee Valley handle it the shipping charges etc would have been under 10 bucks....by using my UPS account number they decided to charge me nearly 50 bucks for shipping and over 50 bucks for the "customs fee"....
If you order something from an established business, it's cheaper and less stressful to let them use their system as they probably have refined it over the years and have established a working relationship with the transport folks.....
My mistake was thinking that since I had the accounts why not use them, but it made the system take a large BURP!

[Tylerdurden]

Chuck, I got home this morning to find 12 parcels on my doorstep.
I look and only one is mine. Seven other addresses appear.
I called and they said they would be by the next day. I said "Are you paying me for storage" You can guess their response.

I left it as If you are not here by 5 pm I am throwing it all on the side of the road. The girl said I would be responsible. Sure as hell am you idiot I am calling ain't I.

Man

[GregW]

Ok... so when you buy something from another country, and have it shipped to you, how do you know how much this extra charge is going to be?...

There are two issues here. One is the duty/customs that, in your case, USA customs charges, and the "customs clearing fees" that the shipper (in Palladin's example UPS) charges you.

Flying Orca described how to bi-pass the UPS fees.

The best way to find out in advance how much USA customs is going to charge you, is to give then a call, with all details of the what is being shipped. They should be able to give you a price over the phone.

[CK 17]

May I recommend DHL, or does that violate some board rules. . . . . They can get stuff over borders--been doing it for years

[abe]

DHL? Knew a fellow boat builder who once posted here and was employed by DHL. A neighbor as a matter of fact. Haven't heard from him since he relocated south. Good guy:D

Sorry to hear of your troubles Chuck.

My recent experience with Lee Valley was great. Ordered $50 worth of hardware Nov. 1st over telephone; shipped FED EX on Nov 2nd, arrived here in New Hampshire Nov 5th. Less than $10 shipping cost I believe.
As a matter of fact, son-in- law has purchased from Lee Valley as well. Never a problem. I was always under the impression that the material is shipped out of NY State. Where it originates from is no longer a concern.

abe

[J. A.Tones]

Welcome to the world of trans-border courier firms. I buy a lot of stuff from USA companies and thru E-Bay and will not purchase or bid until I have an e-mail from the seller stating that they will ship via USPS services. I bought a couple of gaskets for my old Volvo a few years ago and they were shipped UPS. When they arrived 10 days later, the driver wanted me to pay $35.50 brokerage and duty on a parcel that cost $1.85 Told him to take it where ever he wanted but I was NOT paying that sort of ridiculous charge. Got on the phone to the supplier and they were shocked - thought they were doing the right thing as it would be quicker. They sent another pair of gaskets in a padded envelope via USPS Air and it was delivered with our mail 3 days later - no charges at all!
When you are in Canada especially (I of course don't know how the US system works) and you are buying from the US, most suppliers are already aware of the problem and do not hestitate to ship via the postal service.
Just so you can't say you were never told <grin>

John Tones "Penta"
Sidney, BC

[oldsub86]

Unfortunately, it makes it difficult for us in Canada to buy from the USA. I called a fellow in Georgia this afternoon to order a used mirror for my old Mercedes. He was fine until he found out I was in Canada at which point he refused to deal unless I would arrange to have the package picked up. I explained that it would work fine if he just mailed it via US postal service. He finally relented and agreed to do so but I know it is a pain for him as the couriers will pick up from him and with the post office he will have to go and mail it. The couriers rip us off with the silly brokerage fees. Clearing it yourself takes too much time as one has to go the the courier and the customs office. I find with the post office that half the time, they don't bother to collect any additional monies - they just drop it off.

The other alternative is to have it shipped to a US address near the border. I'm only about 70 miles from the border so that is possible but it still means driving down to get it and then clearing it accross the border so still not easy.

Just silly for most of the stuff that I order that I can't readily get near home. I don't bother to order stuff that I could just go and buy locally as it is not worth the trouble.

Randy

[boylesboats]

I either request FED-EX or DHL for shipping my order(s)..
UPS played around too much

[willmarsh3]

I had a compass shipped from Traditional Marine Outfitters in Nova Scotia to Alabama via Canada Post and USPS. $18 for a box just under a cubic foot and weighing about 10 lbs. It arrived at my door about 2 weeks later. It had been packed very carefully and everything was fine. Not bad. Of course they had to wait until the following Monday to take a batch of shipments to the Canada Post office.

[seedy]

I shipped a motorcycle tire late last year, tried the local UPS store first. I had wrapped it in plastic, used cardboard discs over the openings, and put handles on it. It was not a sloppy job of packing.

The tariff was $36, about $23 if it wasn't an "irregular shape" (boxed), but the weight would be more.

Went to Fedex...$16 for Fedex ground.

I think UPS has been taken over by one of those demonic MBA's.

[Ron Geisman]

Gee, Bob—

Now I finally understand why you order all your fasters only five-at-a-time…

[Gary Bergman]

Hmm, I was just going to order some stuff from Lee Valley, and I'm all over the map, so maybe I'll do without until summer when the ship is in Canada.....NOTE: None 'o my UPS stuff comes by a driver like that!