Searching for a fixer upper...need advice

[Stan Creech]

Hello the forum.

I've decided to start looking for a real cheap sailboat (because that's all I can do) to live on. I don't feel that I could afford to keep a daysailer.

My #1 criteria is 6' of standing headroom, if possible. I guess that the smallest boat having that is what would be appropriate.

I won't get into the other things I want now because everyone , including me, would say that I'm asking for a miracle. I am not interested in racing. A comfortable, seaworthy cruiser is what I want but the amount that I can spend is way to little to get me that.

I am seeking advice on how and where to start looking. I tried craigs list but didn't see much, maybe I didn't do it right because I am not very experienced with internet searches.

I am located in the San Francisco Bay Area and can't travel very far, unless I was very sure that I would not be making a mistake. I am an unemployed student without a car and a fixed and very small amount of cash.


All advice appreciated.

SC

[Thorne]

Keep looking on craigslist. You may need to start off with an old powerboat while you look for a sailboat. Get something in a liveaboard or survivable sneak-aboard slip, as chances of getting a liveaboard slip in the Bay Area are slim otherwise.

[Gary Bergman]

Just rob a bank, and buy my Herreshoff ketch, berthed in a liveaboard marina in Sausalito!.....Standing headroom fore and aft, and an excellent sailing craft........Now, for reality...you'll hafta try and do as Thorne mentioned, but....things are really tightening up around here. I've been a liveaboard fulltime in the Bay Area since 1998, and things are a heckova lot tuffer now. It might be different down around Coyote Point, but probably not...

[Bob Cleek]

Living aboard in most all SF Bay marinas is illegal these days, save for a few super expensive ones where they were "grandfathered in" years ago. "Sneak aboards" are possible, but you have to know the harbormaster pretty well and that means you have to have been in the game for a lot of years and be known. Face it, there are a lot of bums out there who figure living on a beater boat in a marina is a cheap way to beat the high cost of housing and all the marinas are well aware of the game. Generally, such folks contribute nothing to the ambience of the place, either. (How would you like somebody turning the old powerboat berthed next to you into a meth lab?)

Besides, a cheap boat is never cheap. When she starts a plank banging against the dock in one of those big windstorms like we had last week, she's got to come out and come out right away. Not a convenient, or cheap, proposition when it's your home you're talking about. Cheap boats have a way of springing expensive surprises on you.

Forget anchoring out. Aside from the huge pain in the ass of having to row in and out, living off the grid, and the neverending theft problem from your "neighbors," you can bet the Sheriff will chase you off in a hot minute anyway.

Time was, they called living on the Sausalito waterfront "The Last Free Ride." Them were the days. Them days is long gone, pardner!

[Gary Bergman]

Some of those fine folks anchored out, cookin' meth had been sneaking aboard my boat IN the marina, under the nose of the possibly not so efficient harbormaster. They had been there for days, tied their dink to the outboard side of my boat, out of sight, banging nice big gouges in my counterstern, and were enjoying heat, water, and nice bunks. Finally, someone alerted the harbormaster; she tossed them off, with incense and candles still burning! Outside of the obvious fire hazard, they sort of acted like she was the wierdo, as they weren't finished with their wine!...Jessh!....fuggin' burnouts!

[Concordia...41]

Gary - sorry for the problems. I can't imagine what it would be like if someone boarded SARAH :( :mad:

Stan - just drive around the closest marinas. Look for for-sale signs in yards and parking lots close to the water. I get the standing headroom thing, but what is is what is. My 22' has a pop top, and was a live-aboard for a guy that trailered it down from Michigan every winter. And I've seen more than one couple living in 24' or less. :eek: Hey, when you're young, it's a lot easier. ;)

I've often thought that the smart ones took their last couple thousand $$$s and bought a boat. There's plenty more that didn't that are a pay check away from loosing their vehicle and right after that is the roof over their heads.

It's not a luxurious lifestyle, but the investment of whatever you can in a boat keeps you sheltered at least.

Good luck in your search.

- M

[Woxbox]

Another place to look is nonprofits that take boats as donations. They usually turn around and sell them to the first bidder, and there can be bargains.

[Gary E]

Here you are,,,,

How far is Oxnard, California

http://i3.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/d6/f3/efaf_3.JPG

There almost giving it away....
That's big enough to rent out several bunks,,,hey you might even make a profit...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1968-Pacemaker-Tricabin-Cruiser-37-Boat-CA_W0QQitemZ110220568648QQihZ001QQcategoryZ26432QQ ssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[BrianM]

Typical S.F. Bay Area Marina fees $200-300/month for 25' slip

If you want to live on the ultra-cheap.. don't try it on a wooden boat. If it's in good enough shape to be a reliable place to live.. most likely you cant' afford to buy it. If its a cheap "fixer-upper"..most likely you can't afford to fix her (haulouts average $400+ for just crane and "lay days".. and that's not including labor or materials to fix the boat).

Call your local marina and find out when they are having their quarterly auction to unload mainly fiberglass sailboats that irresponsible or incapable have abandoned or had to give up. Get one for low bucks that doesn't leak rain water.

Oyster Point in SSF has live aboard and tons of vacancy.. but I don't know if any of those vacancies are live aboard legal.

[Nanoose]

Considering your constraints, look for something fiberglass, not wood.

[S.V. Airlie]

Just remember, anything that reads " Marine blah..blah " add, another 2K.

It's more expensive than you might think. Doable but...

[Tylerdurden]

Old glass sailboats are a dime a dozen. Make sure whatever it is can be readily moved on its own power.
Also make sure that living aboard is the main goal in life.
If not you are sure to be in a disaster or at the least causing one for someone else to worry about.
I have done it for a season or two in both Fl and Boston.
One frozen winter in Boston convinced me to be well south next time I do. Brrrrr.

[Thorne]

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/boa/559181563.html

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/boa/558710754.html

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/boa/553525990.html

[banjoman]

Craigslist is going to be your best bet. You have to check every day and be patient.

My boat is currently at Napa Valley Marina. They often have boats that people stopped paying their bills on and will sell cheap....sometimes free which we know isn't.

As Thorne (and others) said, livaboard slips are getting hard to come by and many (if not most) marinas police liveaboards pretty efficiently.

I say that you should look at a plastic boat. A cheap plastic boat is more likely to float and be dry inside than a cheap wooden boat.

[Tom Robb]

You're a student? Actually taking classes? Think student housing or room w/ other students.
Buying a brokendown boat to live cheap is a dumb idea. Really, really dumb.
Listen to Unkle Cleek. He knows whereof he speaks.

[redbopeep]

Owning a boat is not cheap. Even a fiberglass boat. Living aboard a boat requires working systems. Not cheap. Not easy. Complicated lifestyle.

Cheap alternatives for a student (ALL of which I've done when I was a college student in the 1980's) include the following:

The more "normal"--

Rent a room from someone;
live in a dorm;

The less normal--
get a job that includes room (like assisting an elderly person);
get a night job and sleep in your car between classes during the day (yes, I did this for an entire semester, crashing on a friend's sofa on the days off, take showers at the gym);
Live in a tent in one or more state parks near your school (I did that for another semester--with my boyfriend, it worked quite well and cost about what renting a room would have but gave us privacy and the outdoors we loved);

Well, I truly believe you'd have an easier time living in your car/van than you would living in an inexpensive boat in the SF Bay area.

Best of luck to you!

[GoldDogs]

Your van didn't make it back to Cali Stan?

or did all those DWI/OUI's finally catch up with you?

[Sven Heesterman]

If you are thinking of going to see or not to see a boat that is a bit further away, ask yourself these questions:
Am I prepaired to pay the asking price?
Am I prepaired to walk away empty handed?

If you answer both with "no" then you don't go.

[Plover]

I can only suggest "wooden boat rescue" all the boats are free! Or if you go to "Boat US salvage" you can find some that are far less then buying one used, of course you have to know what your looking at. Another one is "Boat angel" They list on E-bay and alot of their stuff is what people want to get out of there yards or marinas and try to make money on. It is worth a look I don't know if getting one of them on a peanut butter and jelly buget is a good idea? But always fun to look!
Paul

[redbopeep]

You know, its romantic and fun to "think about" getting an old wooden boat for next to nothing and fixing it up. Less romantic to think about plastic boats, but more opportunity there--especially if you're on a fixed budget.

You say you want:

"A comfortable, seaworthy cruiser is what I want but the amount that I can spend is way too little to get me that."

I usually have a soft spot for people trying to scrimp by and trying to do some romantic thing with an old boat. But, my heart is hardening as I see wonderful boats degrade because their owners don't have the resources to keep them going or to fix them up. Too many people see a boat as a cheap apartment and not much else.

We all like to dream...but you've got to be nuts or have no real plans of fixing up the boat since you have no money. Thus, you'd likely be doing a disservice to the boat and no self respecting wooden boat rescue group should consider helping someone with so few resources get into a wooden boat.

The boat would very likely just end up in worse shape than when it started and you are likely not to be safe while living aboard it. And, you're likely not to be able to live aboard legally since most harbors have severe restrictions on that as well.

So, what you want to do is find a wonderful (wooden) seaworthy cruiser for next to nothing, live on it illegally and at personal risk without liability insurance (to protect the environment and other boaters from you). That sounds like what you're planning on.

Get a grip. Buy a dingy to sail, put it on top the van you'll be living in. Go sailing when you have time between your studies. Buy a liveaboard boat when you can afford the liability, risks, and maintenance.