Spiling for futtocks

[boatrat]

Been trying to fit futtocks to the inside of a 15 ft. norse pram (lapstrake) and am stuggling with pattern making. Should I use a fuss and fidget,trial and error with cardboard or run a spiling block along the spaces between laps and join those lines on cardboard and cut (I've tried both and the fit is poor when spanning 4 strakes) or use some kind of articulating batten or gadget or semi-secret shop trick? Please don't roll your eyes if this should be obvious and that I should know better than to build without plans.I would appreciate any thoughts.

[pcford]

Hot melt glue and doorskins are your friends.

[Bob Cleek]

pc is right. Rip a bunch of 1/4" doorskin strips, which can be cut to length with a utility knife and snapped off. Put them together with a hot melt glue gun and make a pattern. That is the easiest way. Be sure that your pattern is on the right side of the stock when you cut it out, so that you have an edge left to work the bevels.

[John Meachen]

Whichever method you use,the priority has to be holding the pattern in its intended position.If it moves you are wasting your time.With just four strakes you should be able to spile and lift bevels for each strake so that almost no trimming is needed.

[boatrat]

Thanks all. Looks like doorskin for me. SWMBO has a hot glue gun , so I'm ready to play. "Bob, 1/4 in. strips", do you mean narrow 3/4" like canoe strips or something molded more? I am long on canoe strips if they would serve. I see the importance of immobilizing the pattern but easier said than done. Tough in a curved bottom with little to clamp to. Would you try weights like lofting ducks, bricks and braces etc.? Then it gets hard to work around them. You can see I'm a bit muddled. I'm all planked up now and have reached the "tricky" parts, and with gas prices this high I hate to drive to Norway.

[reddog]

boatrat;
Check out the article;"The Incredible Jogglestick"
by Roger Simpson,Issue 39 of Wooden Boat Magazine.
Good luck;

Earl

[Thorne]

What about using those metal-spring binder/paper clips to hold the doorskin sections in place?

If you used two per strake to clamp to an 'handle' strip of doorskin, they'd hopefully keep in place until you can glue or screw 'em into position.

[pcford]

Doorskin is 1/8 thick. Costs about $13.00 for 4'x 8' Make rippings approximately 2" wide from doorskin. Snap off a handy length. Put in place. Trim with tinsnips. Join sections together with hot melt gun. Keep doorskin assembly square to C/L; Use glue gun to tack in place.

Take off bevels and transfer amount to be trimmed away to your new frame. A portable bench disc sander comes in handy here. +/- $150 for Taiwanese versions.

If you screw up, start again with the assurance that you have learned something in that go-around and the next one will be easier.

Rinse, repeat.

[Bob Cleek]

Yea, I misspoke... I meant 1/8", not 1/4". Doorskin is 1/8" thick. Make the strips however wide you want. A 1" strip is fine, but over longer spans, you may want to cut a thicker strip. Sorry to confuse you.

[John Meachen]

Thorne gave a good suggestion for holding the pattern together.For location you have to excercise a little ingenuity and possibly every clamping mechanism you posess or can devise.A straight edge across the boat can be a useful start and a vertical post jammed into place beneath it.Add a couple of blocks to the sides of the other two pieces for a third leg of the triangle and you should have enough location.If you have established the correct plane,you can use an offcut to record the bevels for each plank.Good luck with the job.

[boatrat]

Very good ideas. I think I hit the mother lode here. I should be able to assemble a pattern using doorskin strips, hot glue, clips, a clamped straight edge across the gunwales and triangle bracing. I love the jogglestick system too and would definately try that if fitting a bulkhead and may for the futtocks if gluing up seems too fussy. Thanks to you all. Great bunch.

[ron ll]

Really hard to beat the doorskin strips and hot glue gun. One trick I use is to cut the strips a little short at corners then when transferring to the stock, extend the straight lines to their intersections. Makes it a lot quicker to glue it up. And on larger patterns, throw in a quick diagonal to help keep its shape. Oh, and always remember to unplug the glue gun when you leave. :D

I tried the jog stick, just wasn't as accurate for me. (probably operator error.) I MUCH prefer the doorskins even on bulkheads fitted to an irregular ceiling.

[ 03-01-2006, 11:19 AM: Message edited by: ron ll ]

[DrakeChristensen]

I'm following except for this:

Originally posted by pcford:
Take off bevels and transfer amount to be trimmed away to your new frame. A portable bench disc sander comes in handy here. +/- $150 for Taiwanese versions.Do you mean take off the bevel between intersection of the station & each strake and then sand that bevel on the corresponding facet of the frame at that station?

[pcford]

I'm following except for this:

quote:Originally posted by pcford:
Take off bevels and transfer amount to be trimmed away to your new frame. A portable bench disc sander comes in handy here. +/- $150 for Taiwanese versions.

Do you mean take off the bevel between intersection of the station & each strake and then sand that bevel on the corresponding facet of the frame at that station? If I am understanding you:

Take off bevel at each strake/frame. Transfer to new frame. Remove wood in way of bevel.

[John Meachen]

In answer to pcford,if it was me doing the job I certainly would apply the bevel.After all,if you are certain that the pattern has been held in place and that the bevels you have recorded are correct the frame has to fit.If you lack the confidence,use a piece of recycled pallet or similar low value wood to verify the shape.It should not matter how many planks you are fitting to as long as you apply the correct bevel in the correct place.
I think that disc sanders have their uses for this kind of work but really believe a small bandsaw would get very close to the finished shape.

[boatrat]

If you mean bevel between the two faces of a frame as with a bulkhead, then fortunately for me on a norse pram the upper futtocks are fitted perp to the gunwales not the CL and lie on the strakes with no face bevels. The lower futtocks do run directly athwartship , again not beveled fore and aft and so would lie slightly oblique to the upper. My pattern making should be simpler than most but plenty challanging for me. Oh, I also do need to leave a small limber gap.