Which Small Boat for Small Lakes

[dnartker]

I am living in Northern Wisconsin, just off of Lake Minocqua and the Minocqua Chain of Lakes.

I am considering building a small utility sail boat for use on Lake Minocqua and other nearby lakes.

The design i choose should be with in the ability of a first time boat builder with intermediate carprentry skills.

The criteria for the boat are:

1-Relatevly Shallow draft with the keel up.
2-Cabable of being rowed or using a small horsepower auxillary out board for calm days.
3-Open Cockpit with seating for two adults and a capable of 900lbs of load.
4-Trailerable.

Any suggestions for plans and sources will be appreciated.

Thanks

[Garth Jones]

A Ness Yawl will fit many of your criteria. Glued lap plywood so it will live well on a trailer. They float in less than a foot of water (unloaded) with the centerboard up. They row nicely on calm days, and will sail in the slightest wind. They will hold two adults in comfort and four will work. The max load is over 900 lbs. I would suggest the lug yawl rig for ease of setup, if you are going to be trailering around to various lakes. Here's one:

http://www.slaughterhousegallery.com/Ness%20Yawl/Images/dragonfly1.jpg

I think that somebody with intermediate woodworking skills can certainly build this boat - just take it one step at a time and you will get there. Plans are available from the designer:

Iain Oughtred, Boat Designer
Struan Cottage
Bernisdale
Isle of Skye IV51 9NS Scotland

Cheers,
Garth

[TerryLL]

Welcome to the forum.
The thread you just started seems pretty straightforward. You are looking for a simple boat design that can be sailed, rowed, pushed with a small OB, trailered, and safely carry 900 pounds.

This is one of my favorite kinds of boat design discussions and sure to generate lots of advice and many suggestions for the perfect boat to fit your requirements.

The fundamental issue here is that every boat design is a compromise, and there is no single boat out there that can do the tasks you specify with equal ability.

But just to get things started, I would like to suggest the Windward 17 by Karl Stambaugh of Windwrd designs. Particulars are 17' overall length, 5' beam, centerboard, plywood construction over straight frames, and transom stern.

At 5' wide and 280 pounds she is a bit large to row really well, and a bit small to carry 900 pounds safely. She will sail, but requires careful handling in strong winds. Compromise is what it's all about.

[David G]

Welcome to the forum. There are, indeed, many fine boats that fit the criteria you've listed so far. It would definitely be helpful if you could expand on your design brief. Some added info might include:

What are your sail/row/motor priorities? eg. 70/20/10; or?

Where will the boat live? eg. barn during winter, beach during summer; trailer all year round, except when launched for the day, or?

What sort of woodworking skills do you have? Do you want a challenging build, or something that goes together quickly and easily?

How athletic/acrobatic are you? Do you want a boat that you can really wring out while it flies down the lake impressively, or do you want something more sedate and stable?

The more you can define your wants/needs, the better advice we can offer.

For now, I'll mention my own boat, the Goat Island Skiff, designed by the Australian designer and dinghy racer Michael Storer. It certainly fits what you've described so far.

http://flickr.com/photos/arbordg/sets/72157601232149772/

http://flickr.com/photos/arbordg/sets/72157601223191688/

http://s156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/Hagg%20lake%20Messabout%2007%2019%2008/?action=view&current=DSCF0074.jpg

http://s156.photobucket.com/albums/t4/auroradan/Hagg%20lake%20Messabout%2007%2019%2008/?action=view&current=DSCF0090.jpg

http://www.storerboatplans.com/GIS/GISplan.html

If this isn't the boat for you, it'll at least give you something to compare to. All boat designs are a balance of varying traits and capabilities. The trick is to find the point that is the right balance for you.


"Decide what you want. Decide what you're willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities, then go to work" -- H.L. Hunt

[merlinron]

dnartker,

how you doin' cheeser....
i'm 45 minutes south of you in merrill. good to see another landlocked guy wanting to build a wood boat.

[dnartker]

My intentions are to sail, the oars/motor are only intended to get in and out of the Boat Landing.The boat will be trailered and in an un-heated garage when not in the water.My wood working skills are slow but deliberate. I would consider lapstrap or plywood construction.The Lakes around here, except for 2 or 3 exceptions are not large enough to really fly but are big enough to have an afternoons fun on. The weather patterns are set up about an hour North from Lake Superior, so we can get some wind.Thanks

[C. Ross]

dnartker -
Welcome. I know about four families who have places on Lake Minocqua, and my misspent youth was on a small lake between Danbury and Webster. What a great place for a small sailboat.

I think you'd want to add "needs to handle gusty winds" in your description. You would get decent recommendations about an appropriate sailing rig that would be adjustable under those conditions.

[TerryLL]

dnartker,

So, with the additional information:

Mostly a sailboat, able to handle some gusty weather, lapstrake, trailered, minimal rowing ability, minimal OB power use.

I will have to retract my vote for Stambaugh's Windward 17. A boat like the Ness Yawl or the Caledonia Yawl, as suggested by Garth, would be worth considering.

[ToddFwbf]

Wow! So many fellow Wisconsinites. I was just up your way dnartker.

For many years my family and I camped on Big Lake and would explore Rice Creek in both directions in our 17'6" canoe. Plenty of room for 2 adults and one young teen plus enough gear for all day ventures. If the wind was right we'd rig an old tent fly on a "A" frame mast for the run back down the lake (yeehaw). The last few years we've only made quick trips up though, mainly hanging out around Papoose Lake.

That's a great area and I think you're right-on about getting yourself a small sailboat. There are so many coves, bays, and streams to explore.

C. Ross is absolutely right though, there are some pretty good gusts coming your way, in between dead air. That's a classic combo for going over, luckily the waters are warm. I'd pay attention to secondary stability.

I've been thinking about putting a small sailboat up there for my own use, even if it's once a year.

Keep us informed on your progress.

[Happysailer]

I just put together a Steve Redmond Flapjack up here in north Sweden, it went together well enough with the help of the book which uses it as a photo story.

My girl and I weigh maybe 30 stone together and it has planty freeboard in a chop. We power it with a 2.5hp 4 stroke and it goes well, slippery. Under oars it is a treat and it trailers well.

I have started the mast but it worked out too heavy so we just pootle on the motor and I will continue the mast/sails in the winter. I will make the sail from white woven polyester and the mast from Fir. Maybe i should have routed a hollow mast before laminating.

Someone said a wooden boat is never finished....

Now I have the mold I am making another as a spare and then will move onto another design such as 'Whisp' or maybe a Caledonian Yawl.

As for Flapjack, a great project which goes together fast, once you make the mold, and the boat looks like it will live forever. I wouldnt trust it on the sea though.

Phil

[Chip-skiff]

For daysailing on small lakes (i.e. from a ramp and return) I've never needed a motor. If the breezes go light, you turn back and play them home. Given good judgement, a paddle or oars would be sufficient auxiliary power for this sort of use.

For me, the choice would be between a beamy, stable hull (Hartley 14, catboat) or a narrower skiff that goes fast but is also quite tender and will keep you awake in shifting or gusty winds.

In New Zealand I owned the former sort (a Hartley 14), and I just bought a Bolger Gypsy, a slippery, tipsy little darling, with a 4-ft. beam.

P'raps the key is to decide what sort of sailing you like best.

Chip

[Tuck' Sailin]

Have you looked at a hunter 170? They are great lake boats. They dont come in wood but they have an open back so you can swim and you can install a motor mount into the back aswell.

[michigangeorge]

:mad:Have you looked at a hunter 170? They are great lake boats. They dont come in wood but they have an open back so you can swim and you can install a motor mount into the back aswell.

Just what we need - some more plastic fantastic loaded with graphics ! THIS IS A WOODEN BOAT FORUM - take your Hunter elsewhere ----------------!

[Chip-skiff]

Back to wood— assuming you want an open boat, no cabin or cuddy, the first decision is between a beamy stable hull (catboat type, Hartley 14, etc.) or something a bit more narrow and slick like a Goat Island Skiff, various Stambaugh or Bolger skiffs, or the Core Sound 17.

If you want to go back & forth without having to mind the helm & sheets too closely (relaxation) a nice beamy hull is the ticket. If you're keen for a bit of excitement, and the ability to cover distance, the faster type of boat would suit you better.

Sounds like you need to poke around and do some research. Also, given the sailors in your area who have weighed in, maybe you could arrange some try-outs with them. You'll learn a lot more messing about with actual boats than here in the virtual world.

good luck— Chip

[Tuck' Sailin]

What about a hurricane or hellcat?

[dnartker]

Since the original posting there have been several Suggestions.

I have looked at the Winward series and am serriously considering the 17', however I have oslo looked over the design of the Herrreshoff Cat-Ketch daysailer described in Wooden Boat #187.

Can anyone comment on the two designs, especially for the ability to be built for the criteria laid out?

THanks.

Doug

[Pernicious Atavist]

Sailing canoe--use it year-'round!

[chrisk]

Kurylko's (http://www.dhkurylko-yachtdesign.com/)Alaska may be worth looking at:

http://www.dhkurylko-yachtdesign.com/sailplan.jpg


or his Myst which is more oriented to sailing:

http://www.dhkurylko-yachtdesign.com/myst_images/slpln.jpg

They aren't plywood or lapstrake, but strip planking isn't that hard though a bit more tedious

[boylesboats]

I am living in Northern Wisconsin, just off of Lake Minocqua and the Minocqua Chain of Lakes.

I am considering building a small utility sail boat for use on Lake Minocqua and other nearby lakes.

The design i choose should be with in the ability of a first time boat builder with intermediate carprentry skills.

The criteria for the boat are:

1-Relatevly Shallow draft with the keel up.
2-Cabable of being rowed or using a small horsepower auxillary out board for calm days.
3-Open Cockpit with seating for two adults and a capable of 900lbs of load.
4-Trailerable.

Any suggestions for plans and sources will be appreciated.

Thanks

You didn't mention the length and beam..
An 16' flat skiff would be the ticket..

[Pete E]

Doug, Also take a look at the Mellonseed. It would fit the criteria you listed. I live about forty miles South of you and am familiar with the lakes around you. The thing to consider is the building for the first time. Do the search section for Mellonseed there are several builds to look at. I am sure you could handle it. The supply of wood you need is to be found a hour North of you. From one Cheese head to another. Pete

[slidercat]

I notice that no one has mentioned a small multihull as a possibility.

Slider doesn't have enough payload-- only about 600 lbs. But in other respects it would fulfill the requirements, with the added bonus of being vastly more comfortable to sail than the other possibilities mentioned. That may not matter to us brave seafaring folk, but spouses and children might appreciate it.

In a recent solo cruise, I sailed 38 miles down the coast between a late breakfast and early supper, all while sitting comfortably in an adjustable seat, facing forward, with no boom-ducking and no spray coming aboard.

http://slidercat.com/blog/wordpress/wp-content/gallery/slider1/eveningfmsm.jpg

Saturday night my wife and I went out for a sail on the bay at sunset. The wind carried us down to the channel at 2 to 3 knots, though it was only a zephyr. Once down there, the wind died almost completely, so that we could only faintly feel it on our faces. But we tacked for home, and worked our way slowly upwind back to the bayou. The water was without any ripples at all-- almost an oily calm-- but we kept moving at a half knot, sometimes as much as a knot in the puffs. It was a wonderful evening, and demonstrated Slider's ability to keep moving in very light air, despite her modest rig.


(http://slidercat.com)

[garland reese]

Don't discount the Core Sound 17 from B and B yacht designs. The cat ketch rig seems easy to handle and should do pretty well with the gusty winds (those sprit rigs should spill the wind pretty good.....I'd opt for wood masts I think).

Not sure what the ultimate capacity is for the Core sound, but it should be pretty good. Oars should get you in and out of the ramp area. A small electric trolling motor might be an option.

There are a lot of good designs available that should fit your need.....good luck with your search and happy hunting!