Best daysailer

[esingleman]

What is the best daysailer 22' and under?

here is the criteria:

Shoal draft - Trailerable
Stunning good looks
room for 4 maybe up to 6 but not necessary
good sailing characteristics, but doesn't have to be a racer
Can be singlehanded
No running backstays
Building method not important

My vote: Flatfish (Herreshoff/White)

[Craic]

Swallowboats 'BayRaider'. Meets all your stated requirements, and then some.

[Woxbox]

Chebacco? A shorter cabin and bigger cockpit are certainly possible.

http://www.boat-links.com/PT/PT2001/Jerome-1.jpg

[Rick Tyler]

How about the Newfoundland Trap Skiff? It certainly meets your requirements:

http://www.duck-trap.com/QTRSHOT3-o2.jpg

I think the Christmas Wherry might even be better looking, but it is a lot smaller.

[Steve Paskey]

Flatfish is theoretically "trailerable" but she's not a boat I'd want to launch and retrieve more than once a season.

The Caledonia Yawl is certainly a candidate.

Coquina is more stunning than anything mentioned other than Flatfish, but she's probably too small to sail four in comfort.

I'd seriously consider including Bessie Lee -- a 20-foot Chincoteague sailing skiff -- on my shortlist, even though she's hard chined and apparently no one's sailed one in 50 years. I've spent a lot of time looking at her in the small boat shed at the Chesapeake Bay Maritime museum ... there's something about the proportions and rig that is just right, and I think she'd make a very fine daysailor for a group of 4-6 people.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

There's a Joel White design in "Forty Wooden Boats" - at page 48 - that meets your criteria rather nicely.

[johngsandusky]

The best daysailer is the one you're in at the time. My dory is better than my melonseed.

[Robert W. Long]

I am prejudiced. I brought this Caledonia Yawl home from Woodstock Ill. last Sunday!

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i223/rubjohnson/littleM050.jpg

[Steve Paskey]

There's a Joel White design in "Forty Wooden Boats" - at page 48 - that meets your criteria rather nicely.

That's Joel's 23' Centerboard Sloop. Nice boat, but again we get back to the question: what's "trailerable"? Store the boat on a trailer year-round and launch it every time you sail? Or store the boat in the water during the sailing season, move it once or twice a season at most, and keep it on the trailer over the winter? Big difference.

Both the sloop and the Flatfish belong to the second group. Both boats would need a powerful tow vehicle (large pickup or large SUV), and setting up the mast and rigging would be way too much trouble if you're going to do it every time you sail.

For comparison, consider these numbers. I've added Bill Garden's EEL, another nice option.

Flatfish: 3,000 lbs, 2'2" draft
C'Board Sloop: 2,000 lbs, 1'10" draft
Bill Garden's EEL: 1,340 lbs, 5" draft
Caledonia Yawl: 340 lbs, 11" draft

How 'bout it, esingleman: what do *you* mean by "trailerable"?

[dennisbur]

Miss Simplette by classic yacht design? http://www.classic-yacht-design.com/3ladies/3-miss-simplette/ms.html

[James McMullen]

http://inlinethumb55.webshots.com/12534/2108726080088484686S500x500Q85.jpg (http://sports.webshots.com/photo/2108726080088484686yCCBvY)

A couple of Iain Oughtred's babies. There are no finer sail & oar boats than these.

[G.Sherman]

This one!!!
http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff164/Gaz02026/PICT0039.jpg
… but I may be biased.

[bloggs68]

Another vote for the Caledonia Yawl. Good capacity, very easy to launch, retrieve and rig up single handed. Light to tow but quite a seaworthy craft. Easily customised to suit what you want i.e. open boat or decked/side lockers etc. Reasonably quick to build compared to older carvel designs and cheaper too.

Oh, and good looking (but I am also biased).


http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h131/bloggs1968/Launch051.jpg

http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h131/bloggs1968/LaunchCY.jpg

I think that Steve is on the money with his comments regarding trailering. A boat that is a chore to launch and retrieve will not be used much at all after the initial gloss of ownership has worn off. A trailerable day sailer must be as easy to launch and retrieve as possible. As much as I would love to own Joel White's Lala as a daysailer, I would definitely keep her on a mooring rather than on the trailer for this very reason. Many boat ramps are tidal and being able to launch and retrive in shallow water is a real plus.

Set up time must also be considered. If it takes an hour+ to set up or to pack up, again it becomes and obstacle to sailing and enjoyment so something that is quick to get on the water with and pack up at the end of the day is a must. Some of the smaller unstayed boats like the Caledonia etc are very quick to set up and be under way.


regards,

AD

[Steve Paskey]

Many boat ramps are tidal and being able to launch and retrive in shallow water is a real plus.

I was going to mention that ... thanks! As an example, there are lots of places on the Chesapeake Bay where you could not launch a Flatfish or Lala because the ramps are too shallow ... but you could launch a CY or an Eel.

[Woxbox]

...there are lots of places on the Chesapeake Bay where you could not launch a Flatfish or Lala because the ramps are too shallow ...
...And even if the ramps were not too shallow, the surrounding waterways would be too shallow to sail comfortably, if at all. The best part about these kinds of boats is gunkholing. You want a shallow hull for that, too.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

Steve, you are certainly right; I veered off course when I saw the mention of 22ft. Living with an estuary in sight of my windows I don't pay enough regard to the need many people have to trail a boat.

But that Joel White design is lovely; its a boat that I dream of building for my old age.

[P.I. Stazzer-Newt]

Living proof that sailboat evolution is a VERY slow process.
YBOD (http://www.ybod.org.uk/photologue/photo/2008/mar/21/2008-white-boats-6/)

[Luke1]

Add a foot to your criteria and you have the Joel White 23. Fast, good looking, easily trailerable and even the greenest powerboaters will swing by and give you compliments. I believe it's Joel's design 47 and plans are available from WB.

[Scott Rosen]

I like Joel White's Haven 12 1/2.

It's identical to the Herreshoff 12 1/2 above the waterline. Unlike the Herreshoff, it's a centerboarder with a very shoal draft, board up.

[gray duck]

G Sherman - is that photo on the SE side of Clarks Island?

[G.Sherman]

She's floating in the lagoon just inside Inner Hadley Harbor. Just a herring throw from Woods Hole.

[Swidm]

Hard question for me to answer without resorting to "it depends." My first reaction is to say "the next boat I am going to build" but that tends to lead to a lot of eye-rolling from my wife so don't know if it is honest or just a way to build more boats.

My criteria for a good dayboat is heavily influence by where I sail which is in Georgia with the beautiful Florida coast nearby. Accordingly:

1) Easy and quick to setup and launch.
2) Easy to handle about including multiple means of propulsion (sail, oar, motor). This includes something light enough to fend off of docks without squishing an appendage.
3) Comfortable seating including back support
4) Enough stability so that I don't have to move once comfortable (at least on a low-wind day).
5) SHADE!!! A huge requirement in the south
6) Ability to be comfortable in powerboat wake
7) Shoal water ability (sailing in Florida). This is important enough that I cut out the daggerboard trunk (fine when I lived up north) to install a centerboard. Less performance but peace of mind when sailing in shoal waters.
8) Decent performance including ability to go to windward.

Many of the boats shown here, while beautiful, don't necessarily fit the criteria listed above. In fact, one boat that continually comes to mind was a flat-bottomed 14' skiff that two guys sailed up to Magnolia Beach for the duckworks messabout. They sat on the flat bottom with cushions under them and leaned against the sides. The rig was an easy to setup lug. Best yet was the simple setup that suspended shade cloth over the length of the open boat. Simple but a cool and shady place to relax on a hot day. Of course, I am not a believer of flat bottoms for powerboat wake and had some concerns regarding the speed of the boat but it certainly looked comfortable.

For daysailers I also like sailing canoes or dories set up with a forward facing seat and push-pull tillers. Easy to propel with paddle or oar and balance with a movement of the upper body. Low enough seating to make a small bimini or even umbrella mount possible for shade. Also, small enough to explore the shoreline. My current favorite is a 12' dory I designed to which I plan on adding a bimini and cloth splash deck to fit my requirements. Also helps that I can easily cartop or campertop this boat.

btw, my wife named this boat "Plum Crazy" which is more a comment on what she thinks of my hobby than the color of the boat.
http://gallery.bateau2.com/albums/userpics/12812/normal_IMG_2906.JPG
http://gallery.bateau2.com/albums/userpics/12812/sailing.jpg

[James McMullen]

If you want shade in your boat--and believe me, as a freckle-nosed man of Northern European descent with a history of skin cancer in my immediate family I do!--then it is much better to wear it rather than compromise the windage and handling of your small boat with some sort of bimini or awning. I love these Chinese straw hats myself.

http://inlinethumb38.webshots.com/6117/2338578550088484686S500x500Q85.jpg (http://sports.webshots.com/photo/2338578550088484686ovuOYJ)

[Swidm]

I have plenty of wearable shade since I am unable to mount a bimini on my 12' catboat (pictured below) without performance compromises. However, wearable shade is a lot hotter than shade you can be under since you are closer to the material that is stopping the hot sun and have less skin area exposed to accept breezes. That is why I like a design which allows you to sit on the bottom of the boat (on comfortable cushions) giving enough room over your head for shade without problematic windage.

As for hats, I do like the idea of the Chinese hat since there is some airspace between your head and the hat as opposed to the sailing hats that are out there. Might have to try one sometime on my catboat.

http://gallery.bateau2.com/albums/userpics/12812/normal_1193774801.jpg http://gallery.bateau2.com/albums/userpics/12812/normal_DSCN2766-1.jpg

[Rick Tyler]

The Tilley Airflo LTM5 is my personal sunshade. (Hmm, where have I seen that catboat before...)

[kenjamin]

Best daysailor in my extremely biased opinion is the Caledonia Yawl.

http://ford.physics.fsu.edu/Xena078sm.jpg

Best sunshade:

Mantis by Protecht

http://ford.physics.fsu.edu/MantisSunshade.jpg

[Carlsboats]

Half way between the Haven 12 1/2 and the Flatfish is my Block Island 19, which might work out for your needs. It is much lighter than the Flatfish, and has a lot more room than the 12 1/2. Faster than the 12 1/2 for sure, but plenty of stability as it has more beam. Can be Marconi rigged with no need for running backstays (though mine is gaff rigged). I am not in the boat business but several people who saw the boat at the WB show in Mystic have asked for the plans, and a fellow in Michigan if going to build a BI-19, using my molds.

[Daniel Noyes]

Racing boats are almost alway's the best day sailers.
take a successfull one design and get rid of all the go fast gadgets, simplify ruthlessly and you will have a great day sailer.
the 6 person criteria is not compatiable with a 20 +- daysailer it's like asking what is the best sports car with seating for six, if the boat can cary six in comfort it is not a boat who's performance would satisfy me daysailing.
I recently designed and built the Ipswich bay 18, a boat I designed to be the ultimate daysailer, beauty, trailerability and performance were all high priority. Optimum crew for day sailing is 2 and max that is workable is 4 but then your not really sailing a boat it's a wind powered party barge.
Dan
http://dansdories.googlepages.com/coverimage.jpg/coverimage-large;crop:0.02,0.08,0.96,0.99.jpg (http://dansdories.googlepages.com/coverimage.jpg/coverimage-full;init:.jpg)http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1298/539461971_e0d90d0819_m.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/dansdories/539461971/in/set-72157600336204702/)
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1088/539488390_8615b8f035_m.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/dansdories/539488390/in/set-72157600336204702/)http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1191/539489506_9f175a8bc3_m.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/dansdories/539489506/in/set-72157600336204702/)http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2167/2045098987_52ae58a3b4_m.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/dansdories/2045098987/in/set-72157600336204702/)

[Ryden]

Hi!
I'm new to the forum so mayby I'd better introduce myself.
My name is Anders, i live in Sweden and i sail a traditional Gotlandic two-masted 20' double-ender called Tvåmänning.
She might not be the perfect daysailer but she sure gets all the attention in any port I've taken her with her five sails and smell of tar.

The sweetest daysailer to my mind is a local boat, the Kalmarsund Pilot Boat from the turn of the last century, they are beeing built again on a small wharf (http://www.lunds-boat.com/index.html)right where I used to live.

She is fast, stable and oh so pretty!
http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/7222/lotsbtskumkalmarpf4.jpg
http://lustjakter.se/uploads/IMG_lotsbdjursv0001_1.jpg

Download this movie (http://wbeditor.typepad.com/rudderpost/files/blekinge_2005441.MOV) to see three of these boats going into Karlskrona in the 2005 Blekinge Archipelago Raid in winds of 25-30 knots.

I participated in a competition for traditional boats this summer and picked up a crewmember who is currently restoring a Pilot Boat built by the original inventor of the type back in 1910, hopefylly I'll get to sail it next summer.

[Woxbox]

Great footage & beautiful boats.