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rbgarr
05-18-2009, 03:50 PM
From a Malcolm Gladwell (author of The Tipping Point) article in The New Yorker magazine:

"In 1981, a computer scientist from Stanford University named Doug Lenat entered the Traveller Trillion Credit Squadron tournament, in San Mateo, California. It was a war game. The contestants had been given several volumes of rules, well beforehand, and had been asked to design their own fleet of warships with a mythical budget of a trillion dollars. The fleets then squared off against one another in the course of a weekend. “Imagine this enormous auditorium area with tables, and at each table people are paired off,” Lenat said. “The winners go on and advance. The losers get eliminated, and the field gets smaller and smaller, and the audience gets larger and larger.”

Lenat had developed an artificial-intelligence program that he called Eurisko, and he decided to feed his program the rules of the tournament. Lenat did not give Eurisko any advice or steer the program in any particular strategic direction. He was not a war-gamer. He simply let Eurisko figure things out for itself. For about a month, for ten hours every night on a hundred computers at Xerox PARC, in Palo Alto, Eurisko ground away at the problem, until it came out with an answer. Most teams fielded some version of a traditional naval fleet—an array of ships of various sizes, each well defended against enemy attack. Eurisko thought differently. 'The program came up with a strategy of spending the trillion on an astronomical number of small ships like P.T. boats, with powerful weapons but absolutely no defense and no mobility (sic),' Lenat said. 'They just sat there. Basically, if they were hit once they would sink. And what happened is that the enemy would take its shots, and every one of those shots would sink our ships. But it didn’t matter, because we had so many.' Lenat won the tournament in a runaway.

The next year, Lenat entered once more, only this time the rules had changed. Fleets could no longer just sit there. Now one of the criteria of success in battle was fleet 'agility.' Eurisko went back to work. 'What Eurisko did was say that if any of our ships got damaged it would sink itself—and that would raise fleet agility back up again,' Lenat said. Eurisko won again.

Eurisko was an underdog. The other gamers were people steeped in military strategy and history. They were the sort who could tell you how Wellington had outfoxed Napoleon at Waterloo, or what exactly happened at Antietam. They had been raised on 'Dungeons and Dragons'. They were insiders. Eurisko, on the other hand, knew nothing but the rule book. It had no common sense. As Lenat points out, a human being understands the meaning of the sentences 'Johnny robbed a bank. He is now serving twenty years in prison,' but Eurisko could not, because as a computer it was perfectly literal; it could not fill in the missing step—'Johnny was caught, tried, and convicted.' Eurisko was an outsider. But it was precisely that outsiderness that led to Eurisko’s victory: not knowing the conventions of the game turned out to be an advantage.

'Eurisko was exposing the fact that any finite set of rules is going to be a very incomplete approximation of reality,' Lenat explained. 'What the other entrants were doing was filling in the holes in the rules with real-world, realistic answers. But Eurisko didn’t have that kind of preconception, partly because it didn’t know enough about the world.' So it found solutions that were, as Lenat freely admits, 'socially horrifying': send a thousand defenseless and immobile ships into battle; sink your own ships the moment they get damaged."

The next year the organizers threatened to cancel the tournament if Lenat used a variation of the strategy. He bowed out.

Thorne
05-18-2009, 04:55 PM
A typical reaction at the end by the organizers. "Thinking outside the box" may be a buzzword but is still a serious social and/or corporate offense, punishable by ostracism or termination.

We played a semester-long totally ludicrous wargame in college, supposedly based on real military/thinktank games. "Nuclear" missles fired at each other would magically cancel each other out, killing nobody.

My team won by the simple expedient of taking over the 'free press' (figures about each country and alliance) published by the professor -- he DID say that anything other than violence or lawbreaking was OK. We cooked the figures and our enemies fatally underestimated our weapons production.

Game was worse than a farce, as it taught players to think of nuclear weapons as mere counters rather than what they really are.

Paul Pless
05-18-2009, 05:19 PM
Similarly to Thorne I also 'played' a simulation game. It was required of all graduates of the school of business where I went to school to be taken during your last semester there. The class of approximately 60 was split up into 20 teams of three people each. You competed against each other running a business in a global industry challenge against all the other teams. My team won overall and we completed the class with the highest grades possible. The reason for where we finished: part of the goal of thye simulation was to create an environment where teamwork was important. Many teams could not agree on the set of decisions that had to be made for each business cycle of the simulation. My teammates were completely ambivalent to allowing me to make all the decisions for them. There was never any arguement or compromises to be made.

Tom Hunter
05-18-2009, 06:00 PM
Traveler is a game, set in space (this is really a bilge thread that got up here by accident.) The rules a abstract, simple and as can be seen from the article, not very well thought out. Or at least they were not in 1981 I have not played since about that time.

The computer program did not win, it allowed the computer science guy to run test after test of different fleet combinations. The computer scienentist picked the best ones, not Eurisko. He then ran them against each other. He cracked the rules set.

The other players, who did not have acccess to lots of computing power, were upset for good reason. They were a bunch of guys out on the weekend to see who was the best player. They did not expect to be pitteded against someone who ran 10,000 games on a computer to optimize his fleet. Gladwell is wrong, the humans were David and the human + computer was Goliath.

The rules were not well thought out, but everyone came to play a space battle, except Lenat, who came to prove some important points about the value of computers in scenario evaluation and planning. He got his proof, and it should not suprise us that everyone else felt cheated. It was good of him to withdraw, though it would have been better if someone had modified the rules in a more useful way that prevented this kind of exploit.

Gladwell uses other examples in the original article that are better proofs of his point, on this one I think he got it wrong.

I used to wargame for a hobby, and every once in a while I would find a hole in the rules, usually with similar result.

S B
05-18-2009, 06:28 PM
Eurisko discovers cannon fodder.;)

paladin
05-18-2009, 06:41 PM
such is life...in my case I had not made my rules application secret......and at the last minute the rules were changed to disallow my solution, stacking the cards for the eventual winner.

The Bigfella
05-18-2009, 06:50 PM
My management studies professor and masters thesis supervisor was involved in the design of a certain strategic weapons system, and for that matter in the SALT 2 process.

He said that all the best brains in the nuclear weapons business got out of it within about a 6 month period because they realised that the hawks were running war games scenarios - and they were starting to believe the results, because they knew they had the world's best brains working on the scenarios. "If we do this, we'll lose 130 million, but if we do this, we'll only lose 70 million" Scary stuff.

His view was that it was best for the hawks to be wondering if they really did have the best brains working on it. He was also rather concerned at the potential failure points in the whole nuclear weapons system.

Incidentally... the same issue that you are describing is what makes life fun to be a management consultant. You come into an organisation without all those preconceived rules and barriers and it isn't hard to see where improvements can be made.

This is really shown when you look at where firms source breakthrough ideas. I surveyed the top 1200 CEOs in the country about 10 years back (nothing much will have changed) and only 1 in 40 ideas came from other industries. Myopic eh?

Dan McCosh
05-18-2009, 08:29 PM
Looks like the computer was the perfect psychopath.

I once judged a contest set up by the US EPA, among others, which challenged various college engineering teams to take a stock car, and modify it to maximum fuel efficiency. The contest was called the"Hybrid Challenge". Anyway, one team read the rules, took out the original motor in a Chevy Lumina and replaced it with a VW diesel. They easily beat all the hybrids. The next year, the rules were changed to exclude such simple solutions.

The Bigfella
05-18-2009, 08:38 PM
Most yacht races adopt the same tactics - they ban multihulls

WX
05-18-2009, 08:47 PM
Just read Ender's Game, anyone else read it?

Tom Hunter
05-18-2009, 08:50 PM
Bigfella picked a perfect example of my problem with Gladwell using a game (and the angry players) to prove his point.

We play games for fun. Bringing a multihull to a displacement monohull race makes it unlikely that the monohull captains and crew will have fun. If you want to have fun race other multihulls.

Gladwell is saying that the guy who brought a gun to a fencing match is a David fighting Goliath. Not true, and interestingly the guy who wrote the computer program figured this out, but Gladwell did not.

peter radclyffe
05-19-2009, 12:34 AM
From a Malcolm Gladwell (author of The Tipping Point) article in The New Yorker magazine:

"In 1981, a computer scientist from Stanford University named Doug Lenat entered the Traveller Trillion Credit Squadron tournament, in San Mateo, California. It was a war game. The contestants had been given several volumes of rules, well beforehand, and had been asked to design their own fleet of warships with a mythical budget of a trillion dollars. The fleets then squared off against one another in the course of a weekend. “Imagine this enormous auditorium area with tables, and at each table people are paired off,” Lenat said. “The winners go on and advance. The losers get eliminated, and the field gets smaller and smaller, and the audience gets larger and larger.”

Lenat had developed an artificial-intelligence program that he called Eurisko, and he decided to feed his program the rules of the tournament. Lenat did not give Eurisko any advice or steer the program in any particular strategic direction. He was not a war-gamer. He simply let Eurisko figure things out for itself. For about a month, for ten hours every night on a hundred computers at Xerox PARC, in Palo Alto, Eurisko ground away at the problem, until it came out with an answer. Most teams fielded some version of a traditional naval fleet—an array of ships of various sizes, each well defended against enemy attack. Eurisko thought differently. 'The program came up with a strategy of spending the trillion on an astronomical number of small ships like P.T. boats, with powerful weapons but absolutely no defense and no mobility (sic),' Lenat said. 'They just sat there. Basically, if they were hit once they would sink. And what happened is that the enemy would take its shots, and every one of those shots would sink our ships. But it didn’t matter, because we had so many.' Lenat won the tournament in a runaway.

The next year, Lenat entered once more, only this time the rules had changed. Fleets could no longer just sit there. Now one of the criteria of success in battle was fleet 'agility.' Eurisko went back to work. 'What Eurisko did was say that if any of our ships got damaged it would sink itself—and that would raise fleet agility back up again,' Lenat said. Eurisko won again.

Eurisko was an underdog. The other gamers were people steeped in military strategy and history. They were the sort who could tell you how Wellington had outfoxed Napoleon at Waterloo, or what exactly happened at Antietam. They had been raised on 'Dungeons and Dragons'. They were insiders. Eurisko, on the other hand, knew nothing but the rule book. It had no common sense. As Lenat points out, a human being understands the meaning of the sentences 'Johnny robbed a bank. He is now serving twenty years in prison,' but Eurisko could not, because as a computer it was perfectly literal; it could not fill in the missing step—'Johnny was caught, tried, and convicted.' Eurisko was an outsider. But it was precisely that outsiderness that led to Eurisko’s victory: not knowing the conventions of the game turned out to be an advantage.

'Eurisko was exposing the fact that any finite set of rules is going to be a very incomplete approximation of reality,' Lenat explained. 'What the other entrants were doing was filling in the holes in the rules with real-world, realistic answers. But Eurisko didn’t have that kind of preconception, partly because it didn’t know enough about the world.' So it found solutions that were, as Lenat freely admits, 'socially horrifying': send a thousand defenseless and immobile ships into battle; sink your own ships the moment they get damaged."

The next year the organizers threatened to cancel the tournament if Lenat used a variation of the strategy. He bowed out.
threatened to cancel the tournament, cant change the rules, boys playground nonsense, there are no rules in war

George Roberts
05-19-2009, 09:20 AM
"We play games for fun."

Rational people play for that reason. But computer science and game theory play a higher level game - their game is to play with the game players.

Tom Lathrop
05-19-2009, 01:40 PM
The only way to win a game by not abiding by both the rules and the implied spirit of the rules is to play against others who do abide by these rules. All games are defined by their rules. No rules--no game.

David and Goliath is a story about good and evil, hero and villain, or so we are told. Who knows? Goliath may have been a nice guy, conscripted into the army. We do know that David proved to have some serious character flaws.

Some play by looking to improve ability and some play by looking for loopholes to exploit. Both sides have some value. Even port tackers have a story to tell.

Gladwell's story is about basketball and it's a great fun to see an underdog win, playing within the rules but outside convention.