What is your favorite Bolger design?

[straightandtrue]

I have seen his 23' Fantail Launch built by an Oxford, MD builder, a wood delight. Do you have a design by Mr. Bolger that warms your heart?

I read Philip Bolger's, NA, obituary in today's New York Times. Happy sailing Mr. Bolger!

[Capt Nat]

...electric launch "Lily" and
...outboard cruiser "Champlain"...

...my "Lily" is under construction in the shop now...

[Bobcat]

Bobcat

(No surprise there)

[johngsandusky]

Moccasin, or the lapstrake Chebacco.

[David G]

Too many candidates. I think I'd have to break it down into categories somehow.

[TimH]

gull

[outofthenorm]

HMS Rose is right up there.

http://www.pioneernet.net/bobz3/images/nightRose.jpg

[rbgarr]

Defender

[spirit]

The clamskiff is typical of Bolger: very well designed for its purpose, extremely practical, simple, easy to build, inelegant and very satisfying to own and use.

[Stu Fyfe]

Too many catagories, so many designs! I, of course am partial to my Bolger triple keel sloop which I launched today for her 28th season.
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_SHBgt6toQvQ/R6JSXX_FN1I/AAAAAAAAALg/o5l42Gq3RCA/s400/is_00056.jpg

[Robmill0605]

Sneakeasy and Champlain and, oh hell I like them all.

[htom]

Folding Schooner, if for no other reason than the class rules.

Too many that are too good to make anything like a rational choice.

[Wild Dingo]

Simple

St Valery :cool: :cool:

[Captain Blight]

St-Valery

HMS Rose

Blackbird ::wipes streak of drool from chin::



Question: What happens now with his designs that have had plans for them sold, but not built? Can the plans be transferred openly, or would an honest man send Suzanne a check?

[Dave Wright]

Cartopper for sailing afternoons.
Diablo for outboard afternoons.
Samuel Clyde for long weekends, but lose the I/O and go with twin outboards.
Reasons: simplicity of construction, value for dollar spent.

[retrowood]

Sea Hawk for it's graceful simplicity.

Retrowood

[Paul Pless]

Question: What happens now with his designs that have had plans for them sold, but not built? If a boat hasn't been built to an individual set of plans then the right to build 'one boat' to said plans remains transferable.

[Lance F. Gunderson]

While I like many of his designs, I think I'd have to pick Moccasin as my favorite, with Burgandy, Manatee, Skillegalle, Palo de Agua, Dakini and of course the Light Dory as close seconds. I'm currently sailing a Black Skimmer, my second. I built a Surf back in 1977 which was a lot of fun too. I hope Suzanne will publish a complete list of his designs...something on the order of Richard Henderson's book on Phil Rhodes. Oh, I forgot to mention Africa, the cutter he designed for Brad Story. I had the great pleasure of sailing her once and offered to buy her if she ever came up for sale; I understand she was lengthened into a small schooner...which I would not like at all.

[Tom Montgomery]

My favorite is Spartina. Mr. Bolger also seemed to be particularly fond of this pretty little centerboard, lapstrake sloop.

[Howard Sharp]

Dakini. A few years ago I missed buying her by a couple of days, for which I am still sad. But I think all his designs stand out. I am always amazed at how "shippy" they all are when you see them up close.

[Lance F. Gunderson]

Mait Edey was sorry he sold Dakini and was thinking of trying to buy her back. He said he wanted to see the sun rise and set from a boat once again. I sent him an e mail inquiring as to her whereabouts but haven't heard back yet. I had the pleasure of crewing on Dakini several times and liked her a lot; she is especially comfortable below.

[ben2go]

I haven't ever found a Bolger boat that I didn't like.If I must choose one,it'd be the Sneakeasy.It takes me back to a time in which I wished I had lived.A simpler easier time.

[Rigadog]

While I like many of his designs, I think I'd have to pick Moccasin as my favorite, with Burgandy, Manatee, Skillegalle, Palo de Agua, Dakini and of course the Light Dory as close seconds. I'm currently sailing a Black Skimmer, my second. I built a Surf back in 1977 which was a lot of fun too. I hope Suzanne will publish a complete list of his designs...something on the order of Richard Henderson's book on Phil Rhodes. Oh, I forgot to mention Africa, the cutter he designed for Brad Story. I had the great pleasure of sailing her once and offered to buy her if she ever came up for sale; I understand she was lengthened into a small schooner...which I would not like at all.

Why doesn't the Black Skimmer come higher up on the list?

[Arko]

gull

Second that.

[kenjamin]

Japanese Beach Cruiser with Birdwatcher a close second – good Florida boats. :cool:

[VikingSailor]

That is easy for me.........the Folding Schooner, a typical Bolger bit of Yankee fun......what's not to like about a schooner which folds in half?

Here is my "Dark Star".......

http://s577.photobucket.com/albums/ss214/VikingSailor58/Folding%20Schooner/th_Jerysfoldingschooner030.jpg

[paladin]

Blackbird and St Valery...

[Russ Manheimer]

Spartina, then Moccasin and maybe Alert. Love his barge type cruisers like Manatee. Spent many an imaginary hour aboard her.

And of couse the humble Elegant Punt. I've built four of them. The last two are still sailing up at my brother's. I may bring them to the Bolger gathering this fall.

[Daniel Noyes]

Harbinger

I had the pleasure of helping to maintain her for a couple yrs. This boat influenced my ideas on deck design and also made the point that speed is not entirely a function of sail area.

Mouser is also pretty cool.

looking forward to the Bolger Boats gathering, wonder if it will corespond with the Gloucester Schooner Fest or later, could be a busy boat fall.

Dan
http://dansdories.googlepages.com

[Steve Paskey]

The canoe yawl Nord Koster:

http://www.boatbldr.com/html/gallery/photos/photo003.jpg

[Rev Geo]

Micro

[Lance F. Gunderson]

Why doesn't the Black Skimmer come higher up on the list?
I think Skillegalle is an improvement on Black Skimmer, being four feet longer with the same beam, which makes her a much better sailor on all points and especially to windward; plus the offcenterboard eliminates the heavy, ugly leeboards; and she has an on-line motor which doesn't hit the rudder blade when you try to turn to starboard. But only one Skillegalle has been built and she's in Alaska and I'm in Maine (I tried to buy her from Thomas Fulk, the original owner, but , though the price was right, shipping her back to Maine was not cost effective.) I just happened to find a Skimmer on the Navy Yard less than a mile from my mooring, in good shape and at a good price; I couldn't resist. When I had deep draft boats I often though of all the neat things I could do if I had my old shoal draft Tashtego, my first Black Skimmer....plus I kept running aground in the deep boats. Now I'm enjoying the virtues of shoal draft once again. But it would be better in Skillegalle.

[Ed Armstrong]

I haven't seen any of these boats in-person, just plans and photos, but I've always liked the lapstrake Chebacco, the triple keel sloop that Stu posted (love to see some photos Stu), and Blueberry.

I generally prefer traditional designs, but I once saw a Micro in person and was captivated by her uniqueness. She was a rare wooden gem in a marina full of fiberglass.

Ed

[davebrown]

gypsy. great easy first time build. and pretty fast and sea worthy.

[boylesboats]

There's one that haven't been mentioned
That's Queen Mab http://mkstocks.tripod.com/boats/queen_mab/index.htm A very cute little sailing cat... Barely bigger than a bathtub
http://web.comhem.se/chby/segling/QM04-A.htm
http://www.strangepaintings.com/Launchingday.htm
http://web.comhem.se/chby/segling/alstraub.htm
http://web.comhem.se/chby/segling/wburgess.htm
I posted this because, this design rarely get noticed..

[Ian McColgin]

I could not choose a favorite - too many even when you dismiss the aesthetically challenged - but a number of members have indicated that Phil himself was right, the Glouster Gull has ensured that even as I write he's been admitted to heaven. Probably holding a seminar redesigning boats for Gallalie's artisanal fishermen.

On the Gull, seriously, think of the perfection of so many values - beauty, economy, simplicity, seaworthiness, total grace . . .

[davebrown]

and ease of build. with the exception of the stem, it goes together like a simple ply sheet skiff.

[Nicholas Scheuer]

Blackbird, followed by Dovekie,

Moby Nick

[Woxbox]

Lapstrake Chebacco for me, too.

[James McMullen]

That is a hard one. . . .don't want to speak ill of the dead. . . .

I've built quite a few Bolger designs, at least seven that I can remember, and I used to think I wanted to build each and every one of 'em I read about in all of his different books. . . .

But to be honest, I can't think of a single one of his boats I'd even consider using my own money on right now as even the very best of his aren't in the same class of art as designs by Oughtred or Herreshoff or Crocker.
Once your woodworking skills have progressed to the point where "Easy to build" is more or less irrelevant and "beautiful" and "exceptional performance" are primary goals, Bolger has substantially less to offer, despite his vast catalog. I regard him as a fantastic writer and a wonderful teacher, but his actual boats. . . .? I don't want one anymore.

[dredbob]

While there are many that appeal to me, the one that I think I would have if I could afford it is Titania, the 50 foot bermuda rigged schooner from _30 Odd Boats_. Clipper bow, elliptical transome, only 2' 6" draft with the twin bilge boards up. Beautiful, to my eyes, every bit as much a work of art as anything LFH ever drew (and I am a LHF fan also).

And while I don't begrudge James his opinion, I have to think that he's not seen many of Phil's "non-square" designs as I have, because many of them are as traditionally beautiful as the works of the other designers he has mentioned.

Bob

[adampet]

Gloucester Light Dory...I've had mine ten years and it still brings smiles to face every time I sit on the thwart. Whether it's skimming along on a flat calm or surfing standing waves it has never let me down.

I'd love to try some of his Sharpies as Cape Cod Bay boats. The Black Skimmer has always intrigued me, as well as the Advanced Sharpies or Martha Jane.

Adam

[boylesboats]

Lapstrake Chebacco for me, too.

Even carvel planked Chebacco is a looker..

[skuthorp]

Birdwatcher, for me the ideal boat. Saw one for sale in Hobart. Then the Folding Schooner for it's sheer pzazz and performance and Black Skimmer which is probably the most practical for my sailing environment.

[WX]

I've built 2 Cartoppers and had a lot of fun in the one I kept...only problem is recovery after capsizing. They are an absolute bugger to bailout and get back in.
I built a Diablo up in Port Moresby for a friend years ago and got almost hooked on going fast and loud. We put a 25 HP outboard on it and man could it move...great load carrier as well. I must scan the photos I have and post them sometime.

[aeronca52]

My 25 foot Bateau. Has 3 rowing stations, ends decked over, a fourth rear seat for a child, stability, and a great looking shear.

Also partial to the Black Skimmer, Light Dory, Folding Schooner,Tennessee, and a few of Payson's smaller plans like the 10 1/2 Pointy Skiff, all on the bucket list.

[earling2]

Agree with Dan Noyes--love Harbinger. Also Mouser has always looked pretty interesting. But many others--ridiculous, really, how many. Lynx (saw the one and only Lynx years ago--very very cool). Yarrow. Defender (owner/builder). Black Skimmer (owner/builder). Auray Punt (owner/builder). LIttle Superior. Nahant. Palo de Agua. Queen Mab. on and on and on. Nord Koster. And, I have to say, I couldn't DISagree more with James McCullen--I could pick out probably 20 designs from his first couple of books that I would put up against anybody's work, aesthetically, and I think he was the flat-out master of yachty detail (which you don't see on his box boats). Anyway. A shouting match like that never ends well. We'd need exhibits, referees, a bailiff, and a jury.

as for Black Skimmer--I'm a little amazed and awed at Lance F. Gunderson's statements about Skillygalee's sailing abilites, since it's hard to imagine any sharpie being a "significantly better" sailor than my Black Skimmer was. If so, that's a pretty damn good sailing boat. Has he sailed both boats? Is that what I'm hearing? For the record, I'd include Skimmer in the above list of favorites, maybe even number one in function. (I always like Skillygalee, too, but you can't build every boat in the world . . .)

I hope, in the fall, if an when there's a Bolger Regatta, somebody has a Spur II, one of the hands down most beautiful boats I've ever seen. Next to a Brick and an AS29.

[Russ Manheimer]

And then there's the NanoCruiser in this months MAIB. A marriage between a Brick and a Birdwatcher. Pure Bolger. Pure reason and boxy as hell. For everyone of these there's a Gloucester Gull or St Valery.

Has anyone ever seen a Burgundy; Bolger's take on a Welfare Fleet Rozinante?

[earling2]

Never saw a Burgundy. But studied it for several zillion hours . . .

I have a feeling if I spent a weekend gunkholing in a Birdwatcher, I'd probably put that in the Best Of list, too, though they're kind of hard to love, visually

[James McMullen]

. . . . a Spur II, one of the hands down most beautiful boats I've ever seen. Next to a Brick and an AS29.

Oh dear. Well, all I can say is à chacun ses goûts, plus if you build a Brick or an AS29 or any of those sorts of boats you'd better really like it, because you're sure as hell not going to sell it at a profit.

Plus, looking at both a Spur II and Oughtred's similarly Whitehall derived Acorn Skiff side by side really just says it all.

Spur II:http://farm1.static.flickr.com/32/44190880_a0fe58d2e1.jpg?v=0
Acorn Skiff:
http://www.harwoodwatercraft.com/2007%20Acorn%20Rowing.jpg

Was damping down the shape at the stern to avoid a tuck at the transom worth it aesthetically for you? Not for me! Not even for the Whitehall builders who had to plank up the original ones without the benefit of gap-filling epoxy. Good enough just isn't really good enough sometimes.

Still, Bolger was an individualistic genius, no question. I've enjoyed his books immensely.

[T. Traddles]

Spartina gets my vote!

]

[Stu Fyfe]

Here you go Ed.
http://picasaweb.google.com/MacDuff66/Redwing#
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_SHBgt6toQvQ/R6JSVX_FNrI/AAAAAAAAAKQ/ao1uE8qTcqw/s512/is_00124.jpg
Stu

[Ed Armstrong]

Thanks Stu. I was originally intrigued by the design in the BDQ article. Redwing looks like a very nice sloop! I'm surprised to see what appears to be sitting headroom in the cabin. You have some neat photos of Mr. Bolger in that album (and likely priceless memories).

Ed

[Stu Fyfe]

The cabin has sitting head room. Surprisingly comfortable. The pipeberths fold up and become back rests. I once spent three weeks aboard her on the coast of Maine. Yes, many of us on the site have plenty of Bolger memories and stories to tell. The BDQ article was quite a surprise. Redwing is a cover girl!
Stu

[Howard Sharp]

All this talk of designs I've only heard of but not seen drove me to look for 30 Odd Boats on Amazon. Well a new copy now goes for $188, and second hand for $80-90.

[Mark Van]

I like Sneakeasy and the 23 foot light schooner. I think it would be neat to have both boats, they would both fit in one standard marina slip. If the weather was good for sailing, take the schooner out, otherwise, take the sneakeasy out. I did have a ride in a sneakeasy quite a few years ago, which gave me the idea to build a large power sharpie. I ended up living aboard it for 6 and 1/2 years, and cruised over 10,000 miles on it.

[Saltiguy]

Right now, I'm building a "Champlain" design. Very ingenious. Two full berths, enclosed head, hanging locker, nice galley, standing headroom, bow and stern cockpits, more storage than you could ever use, and all on a 22 foot w/L

[earling2]

answering James McMullen, since Bolger even discussed the fact that Spur II is not a whitehall, I would think the issue of a wineglass transom is kind of moot. But since you like them, and it doesn't have one, then.... you prefer the one that has one. I prefer the one that doesn't have one, carries its beam futher aft, and has lower freeboard. (I've rowed a bunch of whitehalls, too, and like something that doesn't have that radical skeg to keep it punching through offshore chop in a straight line. They're a bear to turn, in my experience)

About the AS29 and Brick . . .Yeah, no kidding. They have the resale value of an Edsel. I think that's pretty widely known, no? But they work pretty great, yes?

which five (or seven?) Bolger designs were you disappointed by that you built? (If I remember right, you said you "thought you wanted them at the time?")

And I guess there's some designer out there who's boat you built and loved?

[Brian Palmer]

I am partial to the Elegant Punt because I built one when I was 14. I sailed it with a modified Dyer Dinghy rig for several years before I sold it to Robert Douglas, owner of the Schooners Shenandoah and Alabama. His young kids (now grown men) preferred sailing it over their Beetle Cat when they were very small.

Who would ever think that the likes of Robert Douglas would ever own a "Bolger Box"? Seems rather ironic, but perhaps just another testament to Mr. Bolger's skill as a designer.

Brian

[James McMullen]

Bolger boats I have built: (You can't say I haven't given it a try!)

Teal
Instant Catboat (my favorite of the lot)
Surf
Pirogue
Cartopper
Nymph
Light Schooner
Tortoise

Some of these boats are clearly very minimalistic types and so can be excused from great expectations as to performance. . . . .but I'm used to much better now, and it's hard to go back. However, the Tortoise was without question, the worst dinghy to tow in a chop that I've ever encountered--a complete waste of $40 as far as I'm concerned. I literally gave that thing away after the second cruise. Since I am constrained to always tow my dinghy by the size of my cruising boat, I have done an awful lot of "tow testing" with various shapes and types of dinghy, and there is no question that a sophisticated, round-bilged shape like my current lapstrake pram has less drag and much better sea-kindliness than a hard-chined anything. Towing in a steep, quartering sea really separates out the sheep from the goats. I wasn't expecting much with the Tortoise, and I got even less than that.

Now when my little nephew turns six, I'll maybe build a Teal with him or something like that for his first boat. There's certainly a place for cheap, minimalistic boats. It's a good place to learn. Bolger was indeed a master of this sort of craft. Some people are satisfied to stop at that level.

[James McMullen]

Stu, those pictures of your boats damaged or destroyed by various storms is heartbreaking! Yikes!

[Stu Fyfe]

James,
Those pictures were taken in Hyannis after Hurricane Bob 1991 or 92. Ian McColgin's Goblin was destroyed a couple hundred yards away from Redwing. My boat was riding it out fine until a bigger boat pulled her mooring and swept up the rest of us. It was a heartbreaking scene. The only time I've ever cried over a boat. People were in shock as they walked among the ruins. This storm kinda caught us all by surprise. I was at a Jimmy Buffett concert the night before and he announced to the crowd that we better get ready for a blow. First I heard of the storm hitting us. We had the morning to get ready, but most boats couldn't get pulled in time. She hit us in the afternoon and it was over quickly. Weather forecasters say we're due for another.

[DGentry]

Eye of the beholder and all that, but James - despite her simplicity, the Gloucester Gull is the most elegant dory, ever, and Moccasin rivals anything else in her class.

I do agree that Bolger's plywood and square boats often compromise (some) performance and (conventional) beauty for ease of construction and practicality. But many of Bolger's other designs are both conventionally beautiful and uncompromising in performance.

Regardless, this thread is about our favorite Bolger designs, so I'll add Romp to the above two, as one of only a few 30' boats I'd be happy to circumnavigate in.

I like Eeek!, too, but mainly because I'm apparently the only person to have ever built one (other than the prototype)!

There are some other Bolger boats I have on my list to build "one day," as well . . . .

Dave Gentry

A copy of Moccasin:
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w117/alias1719/HPIM3359.jpg

[James McMullen]

Ahoy, Dave, Moccasin is pretty nice, but even here he spoils the perfection of that sweeping sheer by specifying a straight plank for a railing rather than going to the relatively insignificantly extra detail of drawing a curvy rail that complements the sheer and the curve of the hull. His urge to simplify everything, even details that wouldbe very simpletoadd a little juice to is what keeps him stuck in the ranks of the Competent Craftsmen rather than Transcendant Artist. Iain or Albert or L Francis would have put just enough shape into that rail so that it wouldn't be so jarring and dischordant.

[earling2]

this is probably playing with dynamite here, but I have a hard time reconciling that Moccasin above with the one in The Folding Schooner, which looks great to me. This one... I'll hide behind silence.

Has anybody looked at Stanley Woodward's Moccasin lately? I just did. ...

I'm really curious about this.

(and another thread talks about that unfortunate steering wheel...)

[Lance F. Gunderson]

Launched the Black Skimmer this morning and had my first sail of the season this afternoon after rigging her. Perfect day...SW 5-10, sunshine, flat sea. If any of you forumites want to come to Kittery Point for a quick sail, just let me know. You are welcome. Don't expect hot performance from a Black Skimmer, but for a relaxed daysail over shoal water she's superb. May cause you to re-think your priorities.

[earling2]

You're lucky. I wish I had mine back again.
I'm still wondering if you had a Skillygale at some point. . .

Is your Skimmer rigged with the original mast, or is it the later solent rig?

[Lance F. Gunderson]

Never had a Skille, but almost owned the one that Thomas Fulk built, which is described in 30 Odd Boats. I have sailed Black Gauntlet II, which has similar dimensions. She was very fast, points higher and pounds less than Black Skimmer. Have also sailed Dakini, Red Zinger, Africa and some now forgotten. My current Skimmer is rigged with the original mast as shown on the plans in the Folding Schooner except she has sail track. Today when three of us stepped that 34" 6" spruce stick on dry land without a crane I wished I had the solent rig! I've been dreaming of a lug rig of some type, wondering if it would work on a Skimmer. Say, was your Black Skimmer painted in the Harvard colors? If so I saw her in Edgertown sometime around 1984 when I was there in my Tashtego. She looked good!

[riverat]

Was VECTIS ever built and how did she sail? that is one BIG little ship in my view.

[James McMullen]

Hey, Tom Fulk is a friend of mine! He lives in Anacortes these days. He's working on finishing up a new glued lap pulling boat right now. The guy also makes his own bamboo fly rods too.

We were talking about the Skillygalee and he said that one thing he would definitely change if he were to have one again would be to take advantage of the new carbon-fiber spar technology for her sticks, or at least for the mainmast. He used to have to hire a crane to get it in and out as it was far too unwieldy to handle by hand.

[Lance F. Gunderson]

I usually hire a crane too, but yesterday it failed to show so we took deep breaths ans stepped it by hand, something I do not recommend. We were very lucky and it went well, but one slip would have meant disaster. I have been thinking of carbon fiber masts, but oh are they expensive! Hard to justify on a low tech boat like Black Skimmer, but no doubt they would make her sail a lot better and would last longer; I spent nearly a thousand dollars last winter having a professional re-glue my Pidgeon Hollow Spar which was de-laminating due to resorcenol glue. The wooden mast had also cracked the full length between the sail track screws. Skille had sail track too; I wonder if it gave any problems on her bendy mast?

[earling2]

Lance Gunderson--
wow, that's hilarious. If you saw a Skimmer in '84 (built mine in '86 actually) in Edgartown, chances are that was mine. Harvard colors? At that time the boat was an Interlux sort of robin's egg blue. Can't remember what they called it. Red bottom. White spars, buff decks. It used to hang on a stake in the inner harbor by the Reading Room. funny world. That boat is actually in the background of Jaws 4 The Revenge, when they pan around the harbor at night.... way way way in the background

I used to step my mast alone--and nearly ripped the deck off the boat once, doing it. I would more or less lash the boat to the Reading Room dock at low tide, and then drop the mast ever so gently into the partner's from the dock... only one time I dropped it and it ended up, believe it or not, levered at a 45 degree angle as it hung in the partners... nothing broke. Whew. Never tried that again.

My father later owned the boat and I still have the top 15 feet that he cut off when he made it a gaffer. (not the greatest idea)

I'd go for that Solent rig, if I had another. Yup--I've spent many hours dreaming of the super high tech Skimmer I'd like to build. Carbon spars, Sobstad sails...

Surprised to hear that Skillygalee was that much different of a sailor, though--my Skimmer wasn't slow (and man, reaching over the Edgartown flats on a nice summer day... shoal draft convert for life)

[Keith Wilson]

Bolger boats I've built:
Gypsy
Teal
Rubens Nymph
Cartopper - well, sort of. I converted it to plywood lapstrake and changed it a lot. Fortunately it still worked.
June Bug.

Gypsy's my favorite Bolger boat. A spectacular refutation of the idea that S&G plywood boats have to be ugly, and a surprisingly fast sailer in a strong wind.

[Songololo]

The Chebacco gets my vote:

http://www.instantboats.com/images/chebacco.gif


Although I do prefer the lapstrake version:

http://personal.nbnet.nb.ca/gcobb/GrayCat_02.JPG

[Fritz Koschmann]

I owned Skillygalee for quite a while and I miss her. The only thing I thought of changing was adding leeboards and removing the "off" centerboard. The trunk ruined the cabin. I built Bolger's Double Eagle catamaran and have chartered her for several years. The Bolger design that I keep going back to and studying is Ataraxia in BWAOM. I love the simplicity of it and the look. Maybe I'll build one and do the Northwest Passage.

[Charles Burgess]

That is a hard one. . . .don't want to speak ill of the dead. . . .

I've built quite a few Bolger designs, at least seven that I can remember, and I used to think I wanted to build each and every one of 'em I read about in all of his different books. . . .

But to be honest, I can't think of a single one of his boats I'd even consider using my own money on right now as even the very best of his aren't in the same class of art as designs by Oughtred or Herreshoff or Crocker.
Once your woodworking skills have progressed to the point where "Easy to build" is more or less irrelevant and "beautiful" and "exceptional performance" are primary goals, Bolger has substantially less to offer, despite his vast catalog. I regard him as a fantastic writer and a wonderful teacher, but his actual boats. . . .? I don't want one anymore.

Just like those who love to read Shakespear, Hawthorne, and other literary greats - they all learned to read thanks to the author by the name of Dr. Suse - because they are cheap and easy to read. Sure, after learning to read well you never look back. Burgess, Herreshoff, Alden, and many others authored great yacht designs, but a new boatbuilder can do no wrong by starting out with Phil Bolger designs - because they are easy and cheap to build. Before you can build a design from those at the appex of the field, you must build your boatbuilding skills somehow. I guess you could say that Bolger designs are a boatbuilder's hooked-on-phonics program.

You don't want any of his designs anymore? Congratulations, that means that Phil Bolger was successful, in that you have grown as a boatbuilder and a sailor.

[Lance F. Gunderson]

I owned Skillygalee for quite a while and I miss her. The only thing I thought of changing was adding leeboards and removing the "off" centerboard. The trunk ruined the cabin. I built Bolger's Double Eagle catamaran and have chartered her for several years. The Bolger design that I keep going back to and studying is Ataraxia in BWAOM. I love the simplicity of it and the look. Maybe I'll build one and do the Northwest Passage.


Great to have you on the foro Fritz! Thanks for responding. I'm surprised you didn't like the centerboard; I much prefer it to leeboards. Did you ever have any problems with the sailtrack on the main mast? Mine has sailtrack and the mast cracked between the screws the full length. It was tricky and expensive to fix. I thought of going to Dutch lacing like my old Tashtego had but since I have the expensive sailtrack and the sail is fitted out for it I decided to stick with it, no pun intended. I had a pro do the work and he used the new G Flex epoxy from West, which we hope will allow for some flexing.

[Lance F. Gunderson]

Lance Gunderson--
wow, that's hilarious. If you saw a Skimmer in '84 (built mine in '86 actually) in Edgartown, chances are that was mine. Harvard colors? At that time the boat was an Interlux sort of robin's egg blue. Can't remember what they called it. Red bottom. White spars, buff decks. It used to hang on a stake in the inner harbor by the Reading Room. funny world. That boat is actually in the background of Jaws 4 The Revenge, when they pan around the harbor at night.... way way way in the background

I used to step my mast alone--and nearly ripped the deck off the boat once, doing it. I would more or less lash the boat to the Reading Room dock at low tide, and then drop the mast ever so gently into the partner's from the dock... only one time I dropped it and it ended up, believe it or not, levered at a 45 degree angle as it hung in the partners... nothing broke. Whew. Never tried that again.

My father later owned the boat and I still have the top 15 feet that he cut off when he made it a gaffer. (not the greatest idea)

I'd go for that Solent rig, if I had another. Yup--I've spent many hours dreaming of the super high tech Skimmer I'd like to build. Carbon spars, Sobstad sails...

Surprised to hear that Skillygalee was that much different of a sailor, though--my Skimmer wasn't slow (and man, reaching over the Edgartown flats on a nice summer day... shoal draft convert for life)

I saw a red Skimmer sailing out of Gloucester sometime in the '90's; she had a gaff rig and no bowsprit or leeboards and was ugly as hell, but the crew of several people seemed to be having a rockin' good time. Never saw that boat again. The one I saw in Edgertown must have been yours. I came in late at night and went on up into Katama Bay and anchored for the night; it was the Fourth Of July as I recall. But on the way past I sailed around your boat a few times to check her out. I must have mistaken the Light Blue for light gray in the dark.

[Peter Eikenberry]

Folding Schooner. That took genius.

[earling2]

Lance G--
that could happen. I can't believe it was anybody else's Skimmer since I've never seen another one around there (or anywhere)

I was introduced to leeboards with that boat, and really liked them. I put a two part purchase on each one with a cam cleat, so that when tacking all you had to do was give two huge heaves and the windward board was up. A lot easier than sheeting in a genoa... If I had a million bucks, I'd probably just build another one.

That one Nexus Marine built is pretty gold-plated, by the way, if you haven't seen it. It's google-able.

[earling2]

Not that it matters, but you're right--I did paint that boat grey the year it was launched... man o man, the brain ain't what it used to be

[Lance F. Gunderson]

My Tashtego was in Orleans, near Chatham, when I found her. I launched her at Meetinghouse Pond and sailed around Pleasant Bay for a while before sailing over to the Vineyard. I ducked into a lot of interesting gunkholes that summer on the Vineyard, Nantucket and the South side of the Cape before heading up to Maine, taking advantage of the extreme shoal draft. Later that winter I sailed her all around Florida Bay. Tashtego's leeboards were very heavy and I could hardly lift them, so I put on a two part tackle which solved the lifting problem but created tremendous drag in the water, slowing an already slow boat. My current Skimmer has the one part line as designed and so far I have been living with it as I suspect her leeboards are lighter than Tashtego's were....but they float up at the drop of a hat; I guess Phil was right when he said they do have to be that heavy. L Francis Herreshoff had a good solution to the leeboard lift problem on his Meadowlark, but it is complicated and expensive to implement. I'm amazed at the Nexus Marine Black Skimmer, certainly the most luxurious one built, but I bet she was wicked expensive, and to me that's not what plywood boats are about. Phil intended those boats to be cheap, quick and relatively easy to build. His Mocassin and Africa designs are more elaborate and less cost constrained and intended to be professionally built. Phil could design gold platers if he wanted to, but he seemed to prefer boats for the common man.

[earling2]

yes that Nexus Marine Skimmer is something else, all right. It no doubt cost a king's ransom. I thought it was kind of interesting what they did, though. You're totally right--the Skimmer's not supposed to be gold plater. But then again, why not? Mine was fast and self-steering, ultra shoal draft, had a very comfortable motion--I'd have one again in a heartbeat if I still lived near the ocean. And if I could afford it, I'd put a 4oz layer of glass on it and awlgrip it just like they did. Not sure about the cockpit backrest boxes though... or, rather, I AM sure; I don't really like them. And they ditched the hiking board, one of the most fun things on the boat.

Anyway, no offense, but I'm not understanding where you get the impression a Black Skimmer is a slow boat... I wouldn't have liked mine much if that had been the case. Downwind it was just plain fast.

Leeboards--80 lbs built to Bolger's plan (40 lbs of lead in each).

[Lance F. Gunderson]

Black Skimmers seem to be going fast....until a Cal 22 or similar floating bathtub zips right by you. If you race or sail in company with other boats the slowness of the Skimmer becomes painfully apparent. Also they don't point high and are deathly slow to windward. Downwind with both boards up and the main and mizzen wing and wing she will pass a few boats, but not many. A Sailmaster 22 or a Marshall 18' catboat will sail rings around a Black Skimmer, literally. One of the few boats a Black Skimmer will beat on all points is a Munroe Egret, and an H28. Black Skimmer is wide for her length, and has an outside chine which induces eddying, and she's only 21' LWL. The cat yawl rig in not inherantly fast, and the drag from the leeboards doesn't help either. If it's speed you want, a Black Skimmer is not a good choice. But for minimalist shoal draft cruising, ease of maintenance and low cost, she's tough to beat.

[Rigadog]

Black Skimmers seem to be going fast....until a Cal 22 or similar floating bathtub zips right by you. If you race or sail in company with other boats the slowness of the Skimmer becomes painfully apparent. Also they don't point high and are deathly slow to windward. Downwind with both boards up and the main and mizzen wing and wing she will pass a few boats, but not many. A Sailmaster 22 or a Marshall 18' catboat will sail rings around a Black Skimmer, literally. One of the few boats a Black Skimmer will beat on all points is a Munroe Egret, and an H28. Black Skimmer is wide for her length, and has an outside chine which induces eddying, and she's only 21' LWL. The cat yawl rig in not inherantly fast, and the drag from the leeboards doesn't help either. If it's speed you want, a Black Skimmer is not a good choice. But for minimalist shoal draft cruising, ease of maintenance and low cost, she's tough to beat.


Which version of the Egret are you referring to?

[seafox]

Built surf
always loved the tenneessee
wish I could aford to built the wyoming ( or even better the 104 foot double wyoming with a flat top deck for small aircraft to land on
jeff

[Woxbox]

I'm listening to Bolger podcast #1
http://www.furledsails.com/article.php3?article=777

And to quote Mr. Bolger on the Birdwatcher:

"I still think it's the best thing I ever did."

[Lance F. Gunderson]

Which version of the Egret are you referring to?

Two built from the WB plans; one in Rye, N.Y., the other in Key Largo FL. Black Skimmer outsailed both.

[Rigadog]

Two built from the WB plans; one in Rye, N.Y., the other in Key Largo FL. Black Skimmer outsailed both.

I think the WB version is off the mark from the boat Chapelle described and used to create "Dandy" which has a flatter run, as does Reuel Parker's. WB's is a nice design but I can see why it might be slow.

[Lance F. Gunderson]

In the recent Furledsails interview PCB again expresses his admiration for Commodore Munroe's work. Speed is not the only criteria for boat happiness; good looks, uniqueness, functionality, and just liking it for what ever reason are valid. I happen to like the WB Egret a lot, mostly because of her looks...but I'd rather have a Black Skimmer or even better, Skillegalle.

[tonydezoc]

now James be fair, top pic cloudy day, beardy old fellow; bottom pic sunny day bikini babe.

[boatbuddha]

I think his Teal (along with the ol' PDRacer) is just about the best way to get someone on the water cheaply and quickly. I've always been partial to his advanced sharpie designs, although they won't win any beauty contests.

[earling2]

as for Black Skimmer's performance--
I think frequently people have crap sails on these boats. Most of the pictures I've seen of them show a total lack of interest in/knowlege of sail shape. The picture of Mike O'Brien's boat in The Folding Schooner has a very nice looking main. And the boat is cooking. Ditto the pictures on the Nexus website. Beautiful sails.
My Skimmer, with sails I built (I worked for Hood Sails at one time) was faster than a Soling in smooth water, upwind, tack for tack, tacking inside of 90 degrees easily, in around 12 knots, admittedly ideal conditions. This isn't bullshit--I'm objective and fairly picky/competitive. I routinely passed 40 foot wooden sloops downwind, and often semi-planed on that point of sail. Went from Edgartown to Mattepoisett one day in just under 4 hours, through Woods Hole. Bad sails will make a barge out of anything. As will a poorly setup snotter. I re-rigged the thing, two part snotter (which has to be played a bit with wind conditions), fatter, stiffer boom than designed, two part downhaul, a bit of a fussbudget about sail shape.. .

In choppy water, upwind, the boat was doggy. Otherwise, nope. not at all. Very satisfying, and competitive in handicap racing.

[john welsford]

I'd argue that your comment that the cat yawl rig is not inherently fast is off the mark. What I would argue is that very few sailmakers seem to understand that the main needs to be quite different in shape and cut to the usual sloop main, and the mizzen has its own set of rules as well. If the sails are appropriate to the rig , and the spacing of the sails and masts is correct the cat yawl rig can perform very very well. Especially if the rules dont allow "extras" like oversized genoas or spinnakers the rig is faster reaching and running than a conventional sloop, and is so close upwind that a little skill can see the sloop off.
I've tried the 3/4 sloop rig against a cat yawl in the same design hulls. The rigs were designed to have the SAME HEELING MOMENT rather than being the same area, and once we began to understand the rig the cat yawl was noticeably quicker around the triangular course than the sloop.

But its different folks, so needs different strokes.

John Welsford

Black Skimmers seem to be going fast....until a Cal 22 or similar floating bathtub zips right by you. If you race or sail in company with other boats the slowness of the Skimmer becomes painfully apparent. Also they don't point high and are deathly slow to windward. Downwind with both boards up and the main and mizzen wing and wing she will pass a few boats, but not many. A Sailmaster 22 or a Marshall 18' catboat will sail rings around a Black Skimmer, literally. One of the few boats a Black Skimmer will beat on all points is a Munroe Egret, and an H28. Black Skimmer is wide for her length, and has an outside chine which induces eddying, and she's only 21' LWL. The cat yawl rig in not inherantly fast, and the drag from the leeboards doesn't help either. If it's speed you want, a Black Skimmer is not a good choice. But for minimalist shoal draft cruising, ease of maintenance and low cost, she's tough to beat.

[oldsub86]

http://www.hallman.org/bolger/Illinois/

[James McMullen]

John Welsford speaketh sooth, methinks. My lugger cat-yawl is remarkably better to windward than I had expected being raised on a diet of all sloop all the time. I just sold my big cruising sloop and once I get around to selling the Fulmar I will be 100% sloop free. Yawls is where it's at, baby!

Mr Welsford, do you mind telling us which design it was that you did your comparison testing with?

[Lance F. Gunderson]

http://www.hallman.org/bolger/Illinois/

Do I detect Suzanne's writing style?

[Michael Wick]

I live where the water is shallow. I have a much loved and much modified Gypsy that has served me very well for many years. I keep her on a dolly on a local lake, ready for instant sailing. In the shallow flats inside Assateague Island, canoeists have complained that I was sailing in water too shallow for their canoes.

[john welsford]

I built a 16 ft lapstrake sided water ballasted open boat way back in about 1985. I'd not long before discovered Phil Bolger and had been corresponding with him about a touring rowing boat. He'd encouraged me to carry on with my own designing and suggested sources of information that would be useful. Help that I'm still grateful for!
I put a rig very much like Black Skimmers on this boat ( there is a picture of Hobo in my book "The Backyard Boatbuilder:) in part because I was on short rations financially so used kevlar and epoxy to turn bamboo into workable spars. This boat went like a jet once I got the spars tuned to the sails, and it took the handicappers two seasons to realise that this construction plywood clapboard sided thing with dark tan sails and too many masts was making hamburger out of most of the dinghy classes. We used to sail her wearing checked lumberjack shirts and would have coffee on the downwind legs just to mess with the other skippers heads! It was great fun!
A freind built one, but could not bring himself to use a rig he could not get his head around, so I drew the sloop rig and we sailed in company quite a lot. He thought that the difference in performance was just me pulling the strings more effectively until we swapped boats and he found he could beat me with the cat yawl, not by as much as I beat him when it was the other way around but enough to prove the rig had some advantages.
Over a couple of seasons we chopped and changed the sails and altered the amount of flex in the masts and learned a great deal which has been part of the "professional experience" which has gone into several cat yawl rigged designs since.
When I sold that boat, I took the new owner out sailing. I put the tiller on the deck and using sail trim and movement of crew weight sailed the boat in a series of figure eights upwind, then down, then across the wind and then put the tiller back in the rudder stock. I thought that I'd been pretty clever, but the turkey did not know enough to appreciate what had just been achieved which took the edge of it a bit.
By the way, back to this thread, I built an "Amesbury Skiff Mippett" way back, used it as a tender for my 22 footer, lovely little boat!
My favourite Bolger Design depends upon what mood I'm in, I've sailed quite a few, but think that overall Red Zinger is close to the top of my list. Note that there are a couple of telling remarks about the Cat Yawl rig in his description of that boat in his book.
JohnWelsford

John Welsford speaketh sooth, methinks. My lugger cat-yawl is remarkably better to windward than I had expected being raised on a diet of all sloop all the time. I just sold my big cruising sloop and once I get around to selling the Fulmar I will be 100% sloop free. Yawls is where it's at, baby!

Mr Welsford, do you mind telling us which design it was that you did your comparison testing with?

[Woxbox]

Red Zinger has always amazed me at how much useful and comfortable space can be fit into a 26-foot boat. It answers a lot of design briefs proffered around here. An interesting comparison might be with the 26-foot Norwalk Island Sharpie. The two ought to have a similar sense of space and livability, but the Red Zinger is way ahead, with the space divided into two cabins, ability to really sleep four adults, including a huge double, and a centerboard that doesn't intrude at all.

I wonder how the two would compare in performance?

Details here, page 333:
http://books.google.com/books?id=vBQjV3NZ6LwC&pg=PA333&lpg=PA333&dq=red+zinger+boat&source=bl&ots=GDql-gy2pV&sig=WPXIK2Qg1j68venabkPHsOR59bU&hl=en&ei=q6wxSs_cDsGGtgffx7CtCQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1#PPA333,M1

[B. Parkes]

I always wondered if Red Zinger might be a little bit tender, given how narrow the boat is at the waterline beam. I've never made a comparison with the NIS 26 though.

[MiddleAgesMan]

http://www.hallman.org/bolger/Illinois/

Illinois is the design that got me interested in plywood boats. It was to be my retirement "home" but it just doesn't make any sense anymore what with the cost of building such a large vessel with quality materials.

In his usual manner of speaking the truth Bolger introduces Illinois as a 63 foot "residence." :)

[john welsford]

Its a shape that will carry a lot of ballast in the bottom ,and which will sail well at quite a large angle of heel, same applies to the Norwalk Island Sharpie series. I prefer the narrower flat bottom and immersed forefoot of Red Zinger, motoring will be much more comfortable, and being at anchor in a chop infinitely more so. The sailing qualities should be ok although my own experience suggests that that style of shape will work well at much wider beam to length ratios as long as the bottom panel stays within the 6/1 beam length ratio that Chapelle said was optimum for flat bottomed sharpies.
I've been out as far as 2.2/1 overall but try to keep the bottom panel narrow.
My impression of Bolgers home waters is that a lot of the sailing is done in relatively light conditions, and it could be that here in NZ where a summer afternoon will frequently see 30 knots plus Red Zinger as designed would spend a lot of time well reefed.

JohnW


I always wondered if Red Zinger might be a little bit tender, given how narrow the boat is at the waterline beam. I've never made a comparison with the NIS 26 though.

[MountainMan]

I love the FMS (fast motorsailer) and would love to build one for myself. I have seen scant evidence on the net of builds/plans. Anyone know more about this ingenious design? Does the Bolger & Friends clan still even sell plans?

[Lance F. Gunderson]

I love the FMS (fast motorsailer) and would love to build one for myself. I have seen scant evidence on the net of builds/plans. Anyone know more about this ingenious design? Does the Bolger & Friends clan still even sell plans?

Suzanne Altenburger continues the business at the same address, 66 Atlantic St in Gloucester. Plans should be available from her.

[TonyH]

I keep coming back to the plywood canoe yawl he drew as a "cartoon" for SBJ. I don't think one has ever been built - he never drew out the plans for this design formally.

Although he drew some memorable conventional boats, it is the plywood boats that I think he'll be most remembered for. The wonderful inventiveness he displayed, and the often sublime results he achieved (the Gloucester Gull being a definitive example) coupled with simplicity, really out him in a league of his own. In fact, a league of his own creation.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b4d822b3127ccec81250a0f4cf00000010O08Ict2LlwzbA9 vPho/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

[pippo]

I love many of Bolger's designs, but my favourite ones are Micro, Black Skimmer and Le Dulci-Mer.

[Dave Wright]

I love the FMS (fast motorsailer) and would love to build one for myself. I have seen scant evidence on the net of builds/plans. Anyone know more about this ingenious design? Does the Bolger & Friends clan still even sell plans?

Check out Bill Mckibben's version of the original fast motorsailer, "Ada":

http://www.boatdesign.com/jumps/mckib/Page.html

This gentlemen has built some Bolgrt boats!

[Dave Wright]

This is probably the FMS you had in mind:

http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/fms.htm

I like the original better.

[spirit]

A lot of the attractiveness of Bolger's designs and comments for all of us derived from his willingness to depart from convention, and to try things new. Because of this, it I find it hard to choose favorites. I learned something from each of his very varied designs, even those that were not "pretty" or "elegant" or handsomely done.

[huisjen]

For me, "Sir John Banks", the junk rig steel hull sharpie designed as a low cost south seas freighter.

Dan

[Dick Wynne]

http://www.eastcoastclassics.co.uk/points3.jpg

On the UK East Coast this boat, CROW, derived I think from Bolger's MOCCASIN, wiped the floor with the Old gaffers competition until (as I now expect) its handicap was 'sorted'. Carbon fibre spars, mast counterweighted in a tabernacle using a foredeck slot like a Broads yacht. From the Old Gaffers' website:

Her cold molded centreboard hull needs but two feet of water to float her 34 feet length, her mizzen rotates to furl around the carbon fibre mast. her foresail is self acting. And she sails “Back to the Fuure”, so fast is she- no wonder she is called “Stealth”, not a ripple on the water as she almost dematerialises with speed to the front of the fleet.

[P.L.Lenihan]

http://www.eastcoastclassics.co.uk/points3.jpg

On the UK East Coast this boat, CROW, derived I think from Bolger's MOCCASIN, wiped the floor with the Old gaffers competition until (as I now expect) its handicap was 'sorted'. Carbon fibre spars, mast counterweighted in a tabernacle using a foredeck slot like a Broads yacht. From the Old Gaffers' website:

Her cold molded centreboard hull needs but two feet of water to float her 34 feet length, her mizzen rotates to furl around the carbon fibre mast. her foresail is self acting. And she sails “Back to the Fuure”, so fast is she- no wonder she is called “Stealth”, not a ripple on the water as she almost dematerialises with speed to the front of the fleet.


Something about that hull leaves me thinking this is a Palo de Agua instead of a Moccasin,namely the stem which is "clipper shaped" on Moccassin and the fact that Moccasin comes in at 39'6" VS Palo de Agua at 35'4",which sounds closer to the "34 feet length" from above. Also Palo de Agua was designed as a gaffed rigged cat,unlike Moccasin. Mind you, the rudder looks like Moccasins' and it would be no big trick to add a mizzen to Palo de Agua......hmmmm,wonder,wonder and wonder some more:)


Peter

[Lance F. Gunderson]

In the recent Furledsails interview PCB mentions a book on pulling boats that is in the works. I for one hope that book gets published, as PCB designed some excellent pulling boats over his long career and I suspect there are many who would like to refrance them under one cover. PCB was an enthusiastic rower with vast experience, such as few have today. His ideas on rowing deserve to be better known. I think of his Defender, Spur ll, the Light Dory variants, the Ocean Rowing Project in his book Small Boats, and several interesting pulling boats I saw in MAIB over the years but never saw anywhere else. I wonder what's hidden in the archive? What's your favorite Bolger pulling boat?

[dredbob]

Something about that hull leaves me thinking this is a Palo de Agua instead of a Moccasin,namely the stem which is "clipper shaped" on Moccassin and the fact that Moccasin comes in at 39'6" VS Palo de Agua at 35'4",which sounds closer to the "34 feet length" from above. Also Palo de Agua was designed as a gaffed rigged cat,unlike Moccasin. Mind you, the rudder looks like Moccasins' and it would be no big trick to add a mizzen to Palo de Agua......hmmmm,wonder,wonder and wonder some more:)

No, it is derived from Moccasin, there was an article about the boat in the British magazine WaterCraft about a year or so ago. The guy basically just used the hull lines straight from the book, and modified the rest to suit himself. It's actually a pretty nice looking boat, inside and out. But Phil, when shown pictures and offered a chance to comment for the article, said, as he usually did about modified designs, that it was not his design, and therefore had no comment on it.

Bob

[P.L.Lenihan]

Thanks for the clarification Bob! I always liked they way Phil would politely brush off folks who had "re-designed" one of his designs,often claiming it to be an improvement:)

Cheers!


Peter