pete culler

[al ailsworth]

Does anyone have an opinion regarding Pete Culler designed and built schooners, in the 40-50 foot range, especially if built during the 1960's?

[Thad]

The only one I've looked at close is Gallant, found her sweet. That was more than 10 years ago.

[Brian Palmer]

IIRC, Joel White sailed aboard "Integrity" from east to west and there is a description of the trip in the book about Joel White's boats.

http://www.noahpublications.com/books/joelwhite.htm

Brian

[Lance F. Gunderson]

The infamous John F. Leavitt was a Culler design but not built by him. Some had a low opinion of that design. See the WB article which appeared after she was abandoned.

[Thad]

Some have a low opinion of the Leavitt's handling. For the others it's an easy mark.

[bigwoodboat]

i have heard horrible things about pete cullers designs, especially the ones from the 60's. they say those were his worst years. i have read some of his books, i have concluded that he completely insane. if i were you i would stay far away from his designs as possible.

[Ian McColgin]

It would be interesting to know Joel White's impression of Integrity - anyone able to summarize.

I've spoken with three folk who sailed her and very much liked her.

Like any husky displacement hull, if she's driven too hard off the wind in a dangerous sea, her wake could cause a following sea to break. There is some speculation that this contributed to her loss. This aspect of her sea-keeping ability is a trade-off for other advantages in carrying capacity and comfort and people who sail this type know when to slow down.

There are some of Capt Pete's designs that I find less attractive than others, but his schooner rigs are hard to beat and his schooner hulls will get you there and back.

G'luck

[peter radclyffe]

i have heard horrible things about pete cullers designs, especially the ones from the 60's. they say those were his worst years. i have read some of his books, i have concluded that he completely insane. if i were you i would stay far away from his designs as possible.
i learned of the leavitt in just about the first copy of w b i read in the early 80s, what was wrong with it, and what disturbed you about his designs, i know little about them, but i like to study all designs

[Lance F. Gunderson]

Culler's designs are so salty they make your eyes rust, but the general consensus seems to be that they don't work really all that well despite their good looks and traditional hardware. I once rowed Culler's personal pulling boat Otter for quite some distance; that experience made me appreciate my Bolger Light Dory all the more. My impression of reading Joel White's account of the Integrity voyage is that he was mighty glad to get off her. Still, I enjoy looking at Culler's work.

[Hwyl]

I ran Defiance for a number of years, she was designed by Neilsen and Peterson, she was built by Paul Luke in 1959 and her first skipper and build supervisor was "Pete" Culler.

There were some of his letters aboard, he was opinionated and curmudgeonly, the owner wanted a Concordia and she eventually bought one, but apparently Culler had browbeaten her into this schooner. I heard over the years from people who'd sailed with him and it was universal dislike.

I guess I'm not answering your question, because Defiance is regarded as the best of the Peterson schooners (because her lines were drawn by Nielsen) but the boat could never be described as comfortable. There is an interesting passage in Norris Hoyt's book "Addicted to Sail" about the one comfortable place in the cockpit, where it was nice to relax with your back against the house, and how the crew on board would have a light hearted squabble about who was going to claim that spot. The crew went ashore that day and came back to find that Culler had placed a bracket for the centreboard winch handle, right in the "sweet spot".

[peter radclyffe]

I ran Defiance for a number of years, she was designed by Neilsen and Peterson, she was built by Paul Luke in 1959 and her first skipper and build supervisor was "Pete" Culler.

There were some of his letters aboard, he was opinionated and curmudgeonly, the owner wanted a Concordia and she eventually bought one, but apparently Culler had browbeaten her into this schooner. I heard over the years from people who'd sailed with him and it was universal dislike.

I guess I'm not answering your question, because Defiance is regarded as the best of the Peterson schooners (because her lines were drawn by Nielsen) but the boat could never be described as comfortable. There is an interesting passage in Norris Hoyt's book "Addicted to Sail" about the one comfortable place in the cockpit, where it was nice to relax with your back against the house, and how the crew on board would have a light hearted squabble about who was going to claim that spot. The crew went ashore that day and came back to find that Culler had placed a bracket for the centreboard winch handle, right in the "sweet spot".
sounds like an arrogant troublemaker, ive met too many of those,

[rbgarr]

It would be interesting to know Joel White's impression of Integrity
... her wake could cause a following sea to break. There is some speculation that this contributed to her loss.

AFAIK she wasn't lost, but abandoned at sea. Her hull was found floating, towed to somewhere in the Caribbean and then abandoned again at anchor only to sink.

There was a slim book written about that stretch of her life:

SCHOONER INTEGRITY Frank Mulville

From the accounts of Integrity's owner, Waldo Howland, and the crew who abandoned her, Frank Mulville pieces together the whole story - with a first-hand account of the climax.
'… a gift of description and a deep compassion for ships and people … he tells the story of Waldo Howland and his fated schooner with a seaman's understanding.'
Yachting Monthly
' … a gripping story of the best intentions gone awry.'
Wooden Boat
215 x 135 mm | 170 pp illus. | ISBN 085036 425 6

[Bob Cleek]

It was Culler, I believe, who famously said, "If it looks right, it is right." I enjoy his writing and his designs. There is a wealth of interesting detail and construction technique which Culler preserved from days past. Culler indeed had an artist's eye for a traditional workboat. That said, he was never known for designing "great" boats... just boats that "looked right." "Form follows function," but Culler seemed too involved in form to ever be limited by function. That said, a lot of the old workboats from which Culler derived his inspiration never performed all that well in the first place. If you are seriously considering building a fifty or sixty foot schooner, there are a lot of other far more scientific designers whose designs have proven themselves many times over. If it is schooners you want, consider L.F. Herreshoff and John Alden. You won't find the need to look beyond that.

[James McMullen]

I don't know about big schooners (though I did build one of Bolger's 23' Instant Scooners), but here's what I'd say about the small boats I do have experience with.


Culler: many great looking traditional boats. . . with average performance
Bolger: many dreadful looking non-traditional boats. . . .with idiosyncratic yet generally average performance
Oughtred: Unbelievably pretty boats, high-tech, but with traditional roots. . . .with much better than average performance

I've got all of Culler's and Bolger's books, but I don't build to their designs. Oughtred is da man when it comes to small boats.

[Ian McColgin]

I read Mulville's book and it really does put paid to folk who would baselessly denigrate all Culler designs.

I've met a lot of folk who knew Capt Pete and sailed with him and all found it a good experience. He'd died by the time I got to Hyannis but I came to know Toni Culler and certainly enjoyed her stories. I can see why Capt Burke so loved going over to the Culler's when he was a kid.

He did enjoy his act. George Kelley told of Spaulding Dunbar's visit to the Integrity building site. For the occcasion Pete had all drawings hidden and appeared to be directing everything with reference to the half-model. Very funny story about the clash of two crusty and opinionated gents performing a set piece.

The genius that unites Capt Pete's three major themes - his schooners, his skiffs and his file bottoms - is design to fullfill the purpose, comfort and great economy of operation. Take those file-bottoms in the 20+ foot range. Not fast like a cigarello, but they manage a respectable and comfortable ride in harsh weather with a full load and about 1/3rd the horsepower modern outboarders think necessary. Same with boats like Integrity. I think Goblin - my old Alder 43' schooner - could sail circles around Integrity but for a similar length Integrity could carry about twice as much. And all the skiffs and double paddles and such of his that I've rowed - about a half dozen of them around here - row just fine. I much admire some modern boat designers, especially their ability to make light designs for materials Culler was not alive to use, but for my style something that moves comfortably at three or four knots and can be moved thus loaded or light for a whole day is just fine.

Every boat is a compromise. It's useful for boat owners to gain enough diverse experience on traditional and non-traditional boats that they gain some insight into the compromises they choose.

G'luck

[al ailsworth]

Thank you for your expertise regarding Culler schooners. I was thinking of driving north to take a look at the schooner Gallant, but your comments have quieted my enthusiasm. Still looking!